You can only do so much with a linebacker recruit at quarterback.

Either that, or Scott Loeffler really was chopped liver last year.  Remember all the great things that were predicted for the GPOOE™ last season?  Loeffler was going to make Tim Tebow into a new man.

… Having one of Tom Brady’s formative influences on the staff can’t be bad, but Loeffler’s presence isn’t just a matter of name-dropping association. Loeffler is a top flight qb coach who won’t just work on Tebow’s reads and footwork, but will also build in some new pro-style patterns into the speread option. Tebow has to evolve as a qb, and that’s not bad news, as it means he could possibly be better in 2009 with the right framework.

So how did that whole hope-and-changey thing work out?  Swimmingly.  From the horse’s mouth:

“But there are things that I can get a lot better at — my fundamentals. I’ve never been asked to shorten or quicken my release and not have a loop in it. [Emphasis added.] The changes I’m making have gone very well and it’s becoming more and more natural to me.”

Urban Meyer is the P. T. Barnum of college football.  It’s amazing that the press doesn’t call him more often on outright BS like that.  I guess they’re too worried about their seating arrangements.

************************************************************************

UPDATE: Hey, at least they had a big meeting about it.

… Of course, the question the critics will ask is this: Couldn’t UF coaches overhaul Tebow’s motion while still winning national titles? According to those close to the UF coaching staff, Meyer, incoming UF quarterback coach Scott Loeffler and Tebow himself conferred on this very question when Loeffler replaced former QB coach Dan Mullin before last season. Their conclusion: It was too risky.

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53 Comments

Filed under Urban Meyer Points and Stares

53 responses to “You can only do so much with a linebacker recruit at quarterback.

  1. John

    When the press has an agenda, there’s no way they’ll call him out on it.

  2. On the Bright Side

    “His intelligence level is as high as any quarterback I’ve encountered coming out of college,” Trestman said. “His intelligence is off the charts. After spending time with Tim, it was evident that he learned a lot of football in his four years at Florida — a lot.”

    Weird that two people can read an article and one views it as an indictment of UF coaches and the reasonable one sees it as crediting UF coaches.

    • Oh, please. Who said Tebow didn’t learn a lot of football at Florida?

      You tell me, based on Tebow’s own words – how much did Loeffler do to get Tebow ready to play on Sundays? And was it anywhere near the same neighborhood that Meyer tried to sell us on when he brought Loeffler in?

      • On the Bright Side

        Senator, I honestly don’t recall Meyer ever saying anything about Loeffler, other than perhaps that he’s got good experience (which is true) and he’s worked with some bigtime players (which he has). I admit that there may be more, but I don’t recall any point when Meyer said Loeffler is going to transform Tebow’s mechanics to prepare him for the NFL. Admittedly, that basic theme was conjecture on the blogoshpere, but, to my knowledge, cannot be attributed to Meyer. And yes, reading those comments, it sounds like Tebow’s understanding of the game is pretty advanced even if his mechanics are not. To not give UF coaches credit for at least that much doesn’t seem fair.

        • Meyer clearly said that he was concerned about Tebow’s motion. Since it obviously wasn’t having an effect on his success as a college quarterback, why do you think he expressed interest in tinkering with Tebow’s mechanics?

          • On the Bright Side

            I see a big difference between a coach looking for ways to improve his players (if Tiger Woods and Peyton Manning are always striving to get better through tweaks, Tebow certainly isn’t above it) and a coach who goes out and says a guy is being brought in specifically to enhance a single player’s NFL outlook, which is the attempted spin here. I have yet to see any statement from Meyer that in any way approximates the later, rival fans blogs notwithstanding.

            • Notwithstanding, that’s not an answer to my question. ;)

              • On the Bright Side

                Well, I thought it goes without saying that nobody is beyond improvement, Tebow included. That Meyer expressed a concern (an obvious one at that) is not tantamount to saying they’re brigining in someone to make him an NFL qb. Put it this way, Meyer wouldn’t be doing his job if he didn’t at least try to address glaring holes in his players’ games. That Tebow may or may not have taken to the coaching is a different question.

                • On the Bright Side

                  I don’t think anyone would disagree that Tebow’s fumbles can be chalked up to his long delivery and many of the sacks could have been avoided if he could have gotten the ball out earlier. That Meyer made an attempt to correct those issues (which were in UF’s best interests) does not strike me as devious.

                • What hole in his game? As a college player, what needed improvement?

                  “Hopefully, they’ll screw him up,” said one coach at a rival SEC school.

                  How do you square this with Tebow’s comment that he wasn’t asked to shorten or quicken his release?

                  Face it – either Loeffler sucks as a QB coach, or the whole thing was window dressing in the first place.

                  • On the Bright Side

                    Well, I think we’re at the point where we’ll have acknowledge our fundamental disagreements if you believe certain players are above coaching.

                    • So, do I take that as an acknowledgement that Loeffler is a bad coach, or that Tebow is an uncoachable player? ;)

                    • On the Bright Side

                      Those are valid questions, in my opinion. If I had to wager a guess, it was that his limited time didn’t allow for the fundamental changes that were necessary. Regardless, those questions are much different than the initial point of this post, which is that somehow Meyer is a sleeze for wanting to coach up Tebow.

                    • The point is that by his own admission, Tebow never got the “coaching up”.

                    • On the Bright Side

                      From the article you posted, indicating that (1) tebow received instruction and (2) the instruction was focused mostly on footwork and reads (which is consistent with Tebow’s more recent comment that he didn’t really work on his delivery). Is this supposed to be message board homerism or a more credible and thoughtful football site (which has always been my impression)?

                      “We really haven’t changed anything about my throwing motion,” Tebow said. “What we’ve really worked on is my footwork and drops and making sure I get everything into my throws.”

                    • So, is Tebow lying, or did Meyer? They can’t both be telling the truth.

                      Or did Meyer simply change his mind? Coach’s perogative. ;)

                    • Mike

                      Like I said, I think you are reading too much into it. Tebow was coached just fine at Florida. And I’ll bet if you ask him, that is exactly what he would say

                    • You guys are driving me crazy with this. Point me to where I said he was poorly coached at Florida. Please.

                    • Hogbody Spradlin

                      But this site wouild be credible and thoughtful if we agree with you?

                      This site has plenty of homerism. You’ll get just as good a fight here as anywhere, but you generally won’t get cussed or flamed. If it will make you feel better I’ll call you an asshole.

                    • On the Bright Side

                      No problem with disagreement (or homerism for that matter), just don’t try to tell me that the sky is green. Didn’t really understand how Senator could claim Tebow never got coaching when he linked a story dedicated to the coaching Tebow got. Nonetheless, thanks for making me feel at home.

                    • Didn’t really understand how Senator could claim Tebow never got coaching…

                      I didn’t claim Tebow never got coaching. Tebow claimed Tebow never got coaching.

                    • On the Bright Side

                      Well what is your position, then? Because it seemed that you were criticizing Meyer for not addressing Tebow’s mechanics and then linked an article about the steps they were taking to improve them. That his delivery wasn’t the main focus doesn’t mean he wasn’t coached on the fundamentals. Is that really how you read Tebow’s comments? Only considering what wasn’t done to conclude that he wasn’t coached at all is certainly an interesting way to look at things.

                    • Good Lord, you’re stubborn, Bright. ;)

                      Urban Meyer, at the time he hires Loeffler, expresses concern with Tebow’s throwing motion and release. This comes at a point in time when Tebow is coming off back to back seasons as the most dominant quarterback in the SEC – no small potatoes. Meyer’s interest in tweaking Tebow’s mechanics is greeted with relief – by coaches and fans of other teams.

                      Fast forward to now. Tebow is reconstructing his release point to further his NFL prospects. In doing so, he notes that nobody at Florida asked him to change his motion or his release point. Watching tape from the past season confirms that.

                      So on a very specific point, Meyer is directly contradicted by Tebow. I find this significant because of the recruiting buzz over questions as to whether Meyer’s offense is conducive to a quarterback’s productive NFL career. And evidently I’m not alone.

                      I’m not criticizing Meyer for failing to address Tebow’s mechanics, for goodness sakes. The kid won a Heisman and a MNC with those very same mechanics, so where’s the problem? That’s why I’m criticizing Meyer for being disingenuous about the primary reason he hired Loeffler.

                    • Hogbody Spradlin

                      Last

                    • Bryan Carver Dawg97

                      Of course there is this nugget as well per the Schlabach article: “Meyer said the changes to Tebow’s throwing motion are designed to better prepare him for playing in the NFL. “

                    • Mike

                      Yea, Tebow was so poorly coached he didn’t accomplish much while at UF, now did he?

                      Do you think you guys are reading a *tad* too much into what Tebow is saying?

                      That’s fine. As a Florida fan, I realize that really is all UGA fans have got, relative to Florida.

                      I’ll start to worry when UGA fans talk about all those great wins over Florida.

                    • One more time: this isn’t about Tebow, it’s about Meyer saying one thing and doing another.

                    • Hackerdog

                      I think the issue is that Meyer said they were going to coach up Tebow, but Tebow now says that he wasn’t coached.

                      Nobody was expecting Meyer/Loeffler to turn Tebow into a pocket passer, but it looks like they did nothing.

                    • rbubp

                      I’d say the point of the post was that we cannot tell if either Meyer is sleaze for being liar for claiming they were teaching Tebow anything, or Tebow is a liar for claiming that no one asked him to change his delivery–but out of this it would appear that one of the two is apparently severely flawed. Huh… Meyer’s deviousness is documented, yet largely ignored. Wonder if it’s him that’s the liar?

        • Bryan Carver Dawg97

          Per the Schlabach article: “Meyer said the changes to Tebow’s throwing motion are designed to better prepare him for playing in the NFL. “

      • Rob A

        How was Meyer trying to “sell” anything to the press at the time? I mean, are you suggesting that Meyer had some ulterior motive for bringing in Loeffler or that Loeffler was a bad hire and Meyer was trying to justify it?

        Also, in the article you linked from last preseason, Tebow says that Loeffler hadn’t really changed his throwing motion, but had focused on footwork, etc.

        That being said, the Gator insider internet rumor mill was chattering during last season that Loeffler was brought in for Brantley’s benefit, rather than to try to completely makeover Tebow in the 6 months prior to his senior season.

        • I think Urban Meyer is a very smart man and a very good coach. One reason for that is he’s excellent at anticipating things and coming up with strategies to deal with them.

          There was much chatter (and still is, if you think about it) about how Meyer’s offense doesn’t prepare his quarterbacks to play at the next level. Sooner or later, that’s the kind of thing that gets used against you on the recruiting trail. That’s what most of this stuff with Loeffler was about. I don’t think he was a bad hire, but he wasn’t being brought in to do what Meyer claimed.

          And you need to go and read Schlabach’s article more carefully, since you missed this:

          After playing out of the shotgun exclusively the past three seasons, Tebow will work under center at times this fall. And new Gators quarterbacks coach Scott Loeffler has tweaked Tebow’s throwing motion, turning his sidearm delivery into an over-the-top motion.

          “It’s called adapting,” Florida coach Urban Meyer said. “It’s not a wholesale change, but I was concerned about it. I watched it closely. I’m always thinking, ‘If it’s not broken, don’t change it.’”

    • FisheriesDawg

      “His intelligence level is as high as any quarterback I’ve encountered coming out of college,” Trestman said. “His intelligence is off the charts.”

      We’re talking about the same Tim Tebow that scored 890 on his SAT, correct? I just wanted to make sure I wasn’t getting confused.

      • RedCrake

        I have to say I find it shocking that a coach who has been hired by Tim Tebow and has a vested interest in him being taken high in the draft would say such a thing.

  3. Charles D.

    Meyer can spout any amount of BS that he wants , as long as he keeps winning. An 8-4 season this year, and all the Gator fans, who know nothing of football tradition, will be clamoring for changes and will be calling Meyer out on all the BS he has used the last 4 years.

    Karma is a mofo, and somehow, Meyer has averted its wrath so far. But, just like it got Phil Fulmer and Steve Spurrier, it will get Meyer.

    • I don’t see UF going 8-4 this season, but even if that happened, it would take more than that to change the attitude of the fan base. Two national titles in four years buys a helluva lot of goodwill in my book.

      • Charles D.

        There’s a reason the guy was suffering from chest pains after losing to Bama and there is a reason that Steve Spurrier voluntarily up and left.

        8-4 surely will not get anybody canned, but attendance will drop precipitously and whispers will begin.

        • On the Bright Side

          Heart ailments = karma. Classy.

        • Hackerdog

          Come on. Meyer had health issues during a national championship contending season. There was no great fan pressure.

          And Spurrier left because the dumbest owner in the NFL threw a truckload of cash at him. He was only one year removed from winning the SEC.

          I’m not saying fans would be happy with 8-4 in Gainesville, but Meyer can’t even see the hot seat from where he is now.

          • Mayor of Dawgtown

            Brother, you fail to recognize the collective memory of the attention-deficit Gator fanbase who have the gratitude of a pack of starved pit bull terriers and the disposition to match. These “fans” were complaining on blogs that the Gators were not winning by big enough margins last season and calling for position coaches to be canned while UF was still undefeated. The sense of entitlement in Gainesville is palpable. “What have you done for me in the last 5 minutes” is their mantra. If there is any justice in the universe they will do something really stupid, self-destruct, and football will return to the normal order of things in the SEC with the Gators as also-rans once again. An 8-5 season will have them booing the home team by season’s end. Recruits will witness that and decide that they do not care to compete on the field for the pleasure of those thankless assholes in Gainesville. A bigger group of sniveling, effete snobs has never existed since the ruling elite of the Roman Empire who smugly would turn “thumbs down” and watch the vanquished gladiators put to death simply for their own amusement. When (not if) that happens, the last 20 years will be viewed, in the fullness of time, as the aberration that truly it is rather than the norm it appears to be now.

            • Hackerdog

              Fans do what fans do. UF fans aren’t unique in that respect. I’ve seen many message board posts suggesting we fire Bobo. This is after he led the offense to the highest offensive output in conference games. But none of the UF fan grumbling will fall on Meyer for quite a while (years).

  4. On the Bright Side

    Ahhh, the good ole football tradition comment. If UF knows nothing of football tradition, then it stands to reason that contemporary UGa fans know nothing about winning. As for Meyer, his multiple 9-4 seasons haven’t put him in the doghouse with fans, so I tend to disagree with Charles D’s well reasoned and original take.

    • Hogbody Spradlin

      The fundamental point is that Corch is a hustler and a bullshitter. Lot of people go through life like that. One or two even become president f the United States. He’s landed himself a job at the flagship school in a state with the second most high school football players in the country.

      Is Corch 4-1 against Georgia? Yes. Does that make your shit smell better or make you smarter? Well, we all live and die with our 20 year old heroes for Ole’ Siwash U. So enjoy it, but Corch is still a hustler and a bullshitter.

  5. Legatedawg

    Agreed, Meyer has left quite a trail of BS over the years for anyone who cares to track it. Telling Jevon Snead that he was recruiting Tebow as linebacker is only the chief example. But he was not hired to crank out top-of-the-line NFL draft picks. He was hired to win games for Florida. He can certainly make the case to all their recruits that he is doing that. Nobody is going to call him down for any BS until he is not.

    If our system in Athens has helped more of our top players’ prospects for going the the pros, then it is on our recruiters to use that as a selling point. But CMR and the rest of our Coaches are there to win games for Georgia. The last two games in Jacksonville have been pretty ugly, and we botched three other chances to make the 2000 series more respectable, in 2002, 2003, and 2005 – the latter two games, due to injuries beyond our control, it is true. Such things happen and they are frustrating. But something is going wrong when you have consecutive beatdowns. Hopefully next fall will see a different result.

  6. 69Dawg

    Beatdowns are caused by Defense not Offense. If your D dominates the opponent then the O gets a lot more chances. If your D forces turnovers and takes a few to the house you get blowouts. If your D sucks but your O is great you get a shootout. We have been a shootout team for two years except when we get killed by a great D then we get blown out.

  7. Bryan Carver Dawg97

    Why is it impossible for Gator fans to acknowledge that Meyer is a great coach and simultaneously a great used car salesman?

    • Hogbody Spradlin

      Because used car salesmen have personality.

      Which reminds me of an oldie but goodie: You know what a lawyer uses for birth control?

  8. Dog in Fla

    OTBS, separate and apart from you winning the zombie kill of the day award for persistence, I think it’s the fundamentals of he still can’t throw, period.

    Tim knows it. That’s why Tim’s getting pre-draft coaching now to be taught how to throw (delivery + fundamentals) because Tim says nobody which I guess would include but not be limited to Loeffler, Meyer, Mullins or Mullin’s replacement ever taught Tim how to correct his problems before now. For example:

    Jones-Drew’s cautious comments about Tebow came a few days after Jags’ offensive lineman Uche Nwaneri criticized Tebow’s skills. Nwaneri wrote on a Jacksonville Jaguars message board last week that Tebow “can’t throw, period.”

    Jones-Drew attempted to slightly clarify Nwaneri’s comments: “That’s the difference between college and pro, people don’t speak their mind. Regardless if it hurts your feelings or not, they’re going to tell how they feel about you.”

    http://miamiherald.typepad.com/gator_clause/2010/02/jacksonville-jaguars-running-back-maurice-jonesdrew-has-some-advice-for-tim-tebow.html

  9. 69Dawg

    The preceding has been another example of how in the words of Lewis G, “never wrestle with a pig (UFAG Fan) you both get dirty but the pig loves it.”

  10. Mike

    Florida fans get a lot of pleasure with UGA fans obsessing on Meyer.