Players are from Venus; coaches are from Mars.

Take this as sort of a piece with yesterday’s pot post, but Janoris Jenkins doesn’t understand what all the fuss is about when it comes to his proclivity for producing offspring.

In meetings with NFL executives leading up to this week’s draft, ex-Gators cornerback Janoris Jenkins has been asked about getting in a bar fight, being kicked out of Florida and recurring troubles with marijuana.

He was fine with that. But here is the question that seemed out of place to him: Why does a 23-year-old have four children by three different women?

“It’s weird because I had those kids while I was playing college football and it didn’t affect me not once,” said Jenkins, who is from Pahokee. “I’m proud to have my four kids. If they want to throw that in my face, so be it.

“Everybody has kids. Where in the book do it say you can’t have kids? It doesn’t say that in the law. I’m a great father. I’m there whenever they need me.”

As the article notes, it’s a reasonable response, but the thing is, if you’re a middle-aged, middle class dude who doesn’t share Jenkins’ background, it’s a reasonable question.  Basically what you’ve got are two sides who believe they’re not doing anything unusual here but can’t comprehend the other party’s perspective.

Call it a generation gap, or call it a culture gap, if you prefer.  But when each side sees the other as a bit alien, that has to have a frustrating impact on communication and motivation.  That can’t be easy for a fifty-something head coach trying to get 100 kids rowing in the same direction.  You begin to see the value in having younger assistants with varied backgrounds who can help bridge that gap – starting on the recruiting trail.

The trick is in having the wisdom to judge correctly which gaps can be bridged.

About these ads

161 Comments

Filed under College Football

161 responses to “Players are from Venus; coaches are from Mars.

  1. charlottedawg

    Well I guess failing to wrap up wasn’t limited to defensive players playing under willie martinez.

    • Dawgfan Will

      LOL. As the old armed forces contraceptive training film said, “Don’t forget to put it on before you put it in.”

  2. David

    Whether it’s defined as a generation gap or cultural gap it’s a problem nonetheless. It’s sad for those children and typically this just continues on into the next generation as a vicious cycle. Look at Antonio Cromaritie — 10 children with eight different women and 2 more on the way. Travis Henry, famously had 10 children with 10 different women and while he couldn’t “afford” child support he could maintain a lavish lifestyle driving Bentleys and wearing expensive jewelry.

    I’m not at all against having a big family but come on! And Jenkins is probably just getting started…he’s only 23. He’s an extremely talented football player but acting as Cromaritie and Henry did is irresponsible and unfair to the children.

  3. TennesseeDawg

    In a day and age where birth control is inexpensive and readily available, it’s more a question of whether he has any common sense.

  4. Carolinadawg

    Actually, its not a reasonable response; nor is it reasonable or responsible behavior.

    • Depends on your point of view.

      • 81Dog

        yeah, it depends on if you have the right point of view (this is kind of a problem, isnt it?) or the wrong point of view (what? I may just crank out 5 or 6 more kids I wont be able to afford paying for before I’m 30).

        I’m not a moral absolutist, but there are still things that are right and wrong, or responsible and irresponsible. Jenkins thinks he’s a great father? Who’s paying for all those kids? Who’s going to be paying for them? He’s “there whenever they need him”? How often is that?

        If he’s taking care of all of them, at a minimum, financially, I apologize in advance. But I bet he isn’t, and we all know money alone isn’t enough to raise kids. He sounds like a punk to me. I dont care how well he covers wideouts, and I’m not afraid to call him what he is: a sorry excuse for a human. Maybe he grows up at some point; no one is perfect. Not really any signs of impending growth in the whole “so what? I think I’m great” attitude in that interview, is there?

      • Sure. It depends on your point of view. And from my point of view, I expect he’ll end up paying his fair share of taxes to help assist single mothers and their children who make up the vast majority of the population that receive non-elderly, government entitlements… in about a year.

        And just because you have a different frame of reference… that doesn’t mean your idea isn’t wrong. Societal ills are considered ills for a reason. In this particular case, it is because children borne of single mothers are statistically behind those of two-parent households in education and development which can cause them to be behind their entire academic careers. It is a perpetuating cycle that has put a ceiling on the options for a wide swath of the population that we dance around talking about on this blog frequently. (cue Bill Cosby)

        And my frame of reference: For seven years my wife taught low income households, the majority of which were from single-parent households, and I work in an industry that helps to house similar populations. When you see the issues on a daily basis, it’s not too hard to realize what causes the problems, and the thinking behind Mr. Jenkins’s point of view is a cause.

        • Dawgfan Will

          I teach in a Title I school in which more than 90% of the students qualify for free or reduced lunch. My experience supports your last two paragraphs as well.

        • Cojones

          Thank you both for the reality information. Because of my cultural background, I call it even-handed.My continued remarks are not intended for either of you.

          Who says he can’t afford the kids? Who says an agent didn’t begin to sponsor his training as soon as he was dismissed from FU? I would rather our replies to these articles list unmarried child-raising improprieties other than the affordability. If he is supporting these 4 kids with his money, would that allay your judgements? His “there whenever he needs them” is a self-reference not open to our interpretation nor judgement unless one of the mothers complains. Certainly, his paycheck in the NFL can alleviate any questions AND he can wear and drive anything he wants.

          Of course, one can take the attitude that the “slaves” are restocking the Plantation. College athletes into perpetuity. Sadly, if all are male, one of the four has less than a 20% chance of making it beyond the teen years at present statistical inference. But how is his sireing children any different than popular figures who can support many children because they have money and are stupid as to world population to boot? The ego affrontery extends beyond Janoris. We have a new category in world environmentalism: The increasing carbon dick print.

        • 81Dog

          You make a point I hadnt considered with regard to his payment of taxes and how that will trickle down to help pay for single mothers with deadbeat dads. I guess that’s something, but certainly not a justification for just breeding like a weasel and thinking it wont create any problems for anyone.

          In the legal world, the principle of equity (a court can order you to do something, or to stop doing something) steps in when the payment of money would not be an adequate remedy. Say that you’re a rich guy who’s a jerk, and you like taking a dump every morning in your neighbor’s driveway. Sure, he can sue you for damages related to the daily cleanup, and if you’re rich enough and don’t mind paying the bill, you can keep right on buying the right to leave him a daily present. What your neighbor would really like is for you to stop, not to have the money to just clean up your mess.

          I suppose it’s great, and a point to note, that Jenkins will be paying taxes to offset some of the mess he’s making, but he’s still wrong, and those kids are most likely going to be the ones to suffer the most from his bad example. I feel sorry for them; it’s not their fault that their father (and possibly their mothers, too) is an ass.

      • IndyDawg

        Sobering statistics are sobering statistics. It doesn’t mean grim outcomes inevitable, but we all have a stake in the question posed to Mr. Jenkins, the response and how best to minimize the risks.

        http://www.fatherhood.org/media/consequences-of-father-absence-statistics

    • Krautdawg

      Also helped for years delivering food to poor households, and I agree with what 81 & Trey have to say. But I still have to back up the Senator: in the place Mr. Jenkins comes from, his response is completely reasonable. And everyone he knows would probably support it.

      I think this is more the disconnect the Senator is trying to highlight. We can talk about societal ills all we want, even back them up with peer-reviewed research. But it’s the people behind the statistics who decide what is reasonable in their lives–and as long as their decision isn’t illegal, we all get to live with it and its consequences.

      That’s the fun communication exercise facing Coach Richt and his peers. How do you convince people to abandon behaviors that (a) are totally reasonable where they grew up, are (b) often, pretty damn fun, and are (c) legal (or have been treated their entire life as if they were)? Oh, and the fans would like you to get the message across without suspending anyone. For 3 mil, though … I’d give it a shot ;)

  5. Gravidy

    All this equivocation of generations, cultures, and points of view is OK to a point. And that point is where Jenkins (and others of his generation, culture, and point of view) cease to be able to support their children properly. Sadly, the great majority of this sort of behavior comes from people who jog right up to that point and then pole vault over it.

  6. Ubiquitous GA Alum

    Legal question … Can his baby mommas file a class action suit for child support? … ;)

  7. AthensHomerDawg

    “Everybody has kids. Where in the book do it say you can’t have kids? It doesn’t say that in the law. I’m a great father. I’m there whenever they need me.”
    There is a difference between being a Father and being a sperm donor.

  8. Doug

    “It’s weird because I had those kids while I was playing college football and it didn’t affect me not once.”

    Glad to see he’s got some perspective on things. And glad to see those four kids didn’t get in the way of his football career, because, you know, that would have been terrible.

  9. JaxDawg

    Well, here’s another example of that broken culture I was referring to. How many broken homes, broken schools, broken communities, and overflowing prisons does it take until people start taking responsibility for their actions and for others to stop making excuses for them. Look at drop-out rates, incarceration rates, single-mother households, teenage pregnancy rates, and tell me with a straight face that there isn’t a problem.

    I don’t know what pisses me off worse: John Edwards and his silky-smooth, empty-suit excuses or Janoris Jenkins and his complete disregard for the family unit.

    And while I don’t agree with our President on many things, I do believe his is a tremendous example of a good father and husband. I hope to goodness his example trickles down to the dregs, such as Janoris.

    • Dawgfan Will

      Amen and amen.

    • Cojones

      Aw hell, Jax Dawg, you say the same thing about the coaches! :)

    • Dog in Fla

      “another example of that broken culture”

      Janoris may soon have the opportunity to lawyer up and hold a press conference just like white people do

      http://www.dailyherald.com/article/20120419/news/704199859/

      • JaxDawg

        If you read this again you’ll see that I did mention your friend John Edwards.

        • Dog in Fla

          I read that and am proud of you for being so colorblind. I thought in the spirit of bipartisanship I’d mention your friend Joe Walsh.

          • JaxDawg

            Unfortunately, the statistics are not colorblind.

            • Cojones

              Not if the statistic is covered up like two Speakers of the House in a row sireing out-of-wedlock kids that no one knew about when it happened years earlier. Black males thought the GOP was single handedly trying to outpopulate them. That’s why we have the problem today. This was before Janoris’s time and he was just trying to catch up.

      • Hackerdog

        Statistics of illegitimate births by race.
        http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr57/nvsr57_12.pdf
        I’ll spoil the ending.
        Black 72%
        American Indian 65%
        Hispanic 51%
        White 28%
        Asian 17%

        Whites needs to get busy (see what I did there?) if they’re going to close that gap.

        • Cojones

          Hack- I’ve seen these stats before when the South was segregated and worried that AAs would take over society by outbreeding us. We really have come a long way in our thinking, haven’t we?

          May I recommend “Brave New World” to some of you?

          • JaxDawg

            What’s truly sad is that things haven’t changed in 50 years. Hard to change one’s opinion when the offending crowd continues the same behavior.

            • Normaltown Mike

              Jax:
              Sadly, things have changed…but for the worse. A new book mines data on upper class whites vs lower class whites and finds that over the past 50 years the culture of one is virtually unchanged while the other has seen a dramatic rise in fatherless homes, low education achievement and wretchedly high unemployment for able bodied males. The results of such a demographic shift can’t be good.

            • Cojones

              Us whites ARE a bunch of assholes, aren’t we?

          • Hackerdog

            So, because some people take a prejudiced look at statistics, that means that the statistics themselves are prejudiced? Or does that mean that we should ignore the statistics? Or that we should use some Orwellian linguistic tricks and start referring to illegitimacy as a good thing?

            Personally, I think one can disapprove of illegitimacy without being a racist. But I suppose that sort of thinking is too deep for some of you.

        • Dog in Fla

          But if whites get busy in an effort to close the bastard gap, won’t that foul up their plans to put people into poverty making it so much easier to thereby oppress the victims?

          http://www.npr.org/2012/04/22/151166529/poverty-in-america-defining-the-new-poor

          • Hackerdog

            Not at all. More bastards means more poverty and more people to oppress. Unless you think that the political class, including Obama, only want to oppress minorities. I think that’s pretty silly.

              • Cojones

                Voter ID cards are the beginning. If we researched the backgrounds of all voters, the only voters would be those who could pay to cover up distracting information.

                • Hackerdog

                  What? The laws on the books preclude felons and non-citizens from voting. Voter ID laws simply allow those laws to be enforced. Otherwise, anyone could go into a precinct and obtain someone else’s ballot.

                  • Cojones

                    The “laws on the book” was singular wasn’t it? A few individual southern states and a couple western states don’t make all the rest have such laws on the books. Wherever society is more apt to suppress blacks and latinos is where they pass disinfranchisement laws. You do know that laws against free access of citizens to polls (like poll tax, literacy tests, etc.) have been struck down historically as against The Constitution, don’t you? Voter ID is simply an extention of those laws to intimidation of a segment of society.

                    • Hackerdog

                      What state allows felons or non-citizens to vote? Id laws simply ensure that the person requesting the ballot is the correct person. And the courts have repeatedly upheld voter ID laws. Only idiots equate showing ID, which you have to do to buy cigarettes or beer, with poll taxes or literary tests.

                  • Hacker, one problem with your example. This guy didn’t actually cast a fraudulent vote. And the reason he didn’t was because he didn’t want to be arrested for voter fraud.

                    There are already laws on the books to prevent this kind of stuff, and as your example indicates, they work.

                    Voter ID is about suppressing the vote of certain blocks of voters. If you look at what’s been passed in Texas and Florida, it doesn’t take a genius to see what’s going on. Or perhaps you can explain why a gun license should be a valid ID to vote, while a university-issued student ID shouldn’t.

                    • Hackerdog

                      He didn’t commit a crime because he was recording the interaction for public release. But, as the tape shows, he could have easily cast Holder’s ballot illegally.

                      Tell me, Senator. What if, instead of asking for ID when buying alcohol, we had purchasers sign a sheet that gives their name (whatever name they wish to give), and pledge, on their honor, that they are over 21. Do you think that more teenagers would buy alcohol than currently do? I think the answer is obviously yes. I’m just at a loss as to why people consider alcohol, cigarettes, Sudafed, and R-rated movies to be more valuable commodities to be safeguarded than elections.

                      As to whether the voter fraud laws work, ask Norm Coleman how well they do. He lost with a razor thin margin in an election that was rampant with voter fraud.

                      Voter ID isn’t about suppressing the vote. It’s about allowing the correct people to vote. Artur Davis, a former black Congressman from a majority black district, said that zero black people ever came to him complaining of ID laws being a burden in voting. After South Carolina passed its voter ID law, it offered free rides to any citizen needing to obtain a state ID. In three weeks, out of a state with 5 million people, 23 people asked for rides. Consider me underwhelmed.

                      As to why a gun license is valid ID while a student ID isn’t? Because illegal aliens can’t obtain gun licenses.

                    • He didn’t cast a fraudulent vote because it’s a felony to do so. Who in his right mind wants to cast a vote that would lead to a felony jail term?

                    • Hackerdog

                      He didn’t commit the crime because he was interested in exposing the ease of committing the crime. You may as well ask why the reporters who tested TSA security didn’t actually blow up planes. It’s because they were interested in the enforcement, not the crime.

                      As to a felony law precluding the behavior, that’s nuts. Are you saying that, instead of banks hiring armed guards and using vaults to store money, there should just be signs on the door saying that robbing banks is a felony? Do you honestly think that will result in fewer bank robberies than having a guard with a gun posted?

                      The group ACORN has a host of voter fraud felonies laid at its doorstep. Obviously the law can be circumvented. Easily.

              • Hackerdog

                I didn’t say that the oppression of minorities is silly. I said that believing that the political class, including Democrats such as Obama, ONLY want to oppress minorities is silly. They want to oppress everyone outside of the tiny, elite political class.

                • Cojones

                  Hack- Were you aware that Republicans hired onto Acorn staff and created the “Mickey Mouse, etc.” signed documents that they then took photos of before mixing in the pile as registered voters? Those silly grammar school ploys never had anyone to show up and vote under those recorded (Not!) names, but obviously fooled you and others to believe the nonsense created for frightening the ignorant and played on Fox News. You can make up silly crap all day, submit it in a trusting voter registration setting and try to point fingers. Somehow you never got the final word of the subterfuge by Republicans. Fortunately for all of us, registration lists are vetted in most settings.

                  Do you vote? If yes, then you must know you have to pick up your ballot using your identity as a registered voter. Know anyone with the name and address of Mickey Mouse who voted? It was just more silly “rat fucking” ruse that Nixon initiated; – and we know where his crap led us. But if you wish to keep waving that “Acorn” flag, I’m sure you’re gearing up for a repeat of the “intimidate the voter by recreating the black bogey man” crud started in the last Presidential election. Lotta good it did.

                  • Hackerdog

                    It looks like prosecutors in Colorado, Florida, Missouri, Nevada, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Washington, and Wisconsin were among the poor souls duped by Fox News into charging ACORN officials or employees with election crimes that never actually occurred. And several of those innocent people were duped by the Republicans into pleading guilty! It’s diabolical! I would have to say that a Republican conspiracy of this DaVinci Code-type magnitude is literally unbelievable.

                    As for whether I vote, yes, I do. And I show ID because I live in one of the states that require voters to show ID before voting. Not all states require ID because some foolish souls believe it’s racist to ask someone to prove that he’s actually Eric Holder before obtaining Eric Holder’s ballot. Not that could ever actually happen … wait.

                    • Weren’t the prosecutions you refer to over registration fraud? How does requiring an ID card to vote affect that?

                      That’s another key tell about what’s going on here – it’s easy to abuse absentee voting, but none of these states pushing ID laws do much or anything about that. Why? The answer to that question lies in who is likely to cast an absentee ballot.

                    • Hackerdog

                      Most were registration fraud. Requiring an ID to vote reduces the possibility that someone registers false names, and then votes using those names.

                      I think the issue with absentee voting, which has been abused, is simply logistics more than motivation. My bank is motivated to ensure that only I have access to my accounts, whether I go online, or into a local branch. If I go into my local branch, I have to show ID. If I go to the website, anyone with adequate knowledge of my personal details can register as me and access my accounts.

      • Cojones

        DIF- Was ready to call you forward, but you snuck up behind. Nice point, but there have to be others as well. Sic’em!. Haven’t had this much fun in a while. Enjoy!

      • AthensHomerDawg

        Oh make no mistake Dog in FLa…. Mr. Jenkins has lawyered up before. Surely, you don’t believe that only successful Euro-Americans lawyer up. ;-)

        One arrest for a bar fight.
        One failed drug test at Florida.
        Two arrests for marijuana possession.
        Four children by three women.

        Somewhere in all that he must have become familiar with the workings of legal counsel.

        • Dog in Fla

          I am proud of Janoris for becoming familiar with legal counsel and fee retainers from Huntley Hog Johnson. In fact, in his spare time, Janoris was in the process of obtaining a well-rounded education in Gainesville and, then, he irritated Boom.

          • AthensHomerDawg

            Go on a say it… now what did he do to irritate Boom? Hmmmm? And what was his progress towards that well rounded education? Hmmmm.

            • Dog in Fla

              “what did he do to irritate Boom?” Janoris was (a) uppity or (b) did not like to follow orders.

              “what was his progress towards that well rounded education?” Learning about the legal system so he does not end up like Henry in Frostproof.

              • AthensHomerDawg

                -10 !!! Wait you did not just play the “uppity nigger” card did you? Just how old are you cause that was lame.
                He got punted cause he was busted twice inside 3 months. He started at corner as a Freshman. How many kids at UF have that designation? Make no mistake Musrat wanted the guy on the team. He didn’t get all Urban Meyer and put a walking cast on his ankle come game day, He had no wiggle room .
                As far as his well rounded education. Anytime you get schooled by the judicial system for the reasons he did it ain’t good son. Make no mistake, playing life in that lane can lead to other consequences. And they are not pretty.

                “On June 1, 2009, Jenkins was arrested near a bar by Gainesville Police for fighting and resisting arrest after punching a man in the head around 2 AM. Police were forced to use a taser on Jenkins after fighting
                escalated. When asked why the fight started, Jenkins told police it was because he thought someone was going to steal the gold chain around his neck.[2]

                On April 23, 2011, Jenkins was cited by a Gainesville police officer and charged with misdemeanor marijuana possession. He was cited for the same violation in January 2011, and paid a $316 fine. He was arrested in May 2009 during a downtown Gainesville fight that resulted in probation and community service. On April 26, 2011, he was dismissed by the Florida Gators football team, due to his second drug related arrest in 3 months.[3]”

                ….I guess he didn’t follow orders. “Son quit fuking up!” We good?

                • Dog in Fla

                  Janoris v. Boom was “a skirmish over semantics, and not particularly consequential ones.”

                  http://www.alligatorarmy.com/2011/4/27/2137643/janoris-jenkins-will-muschamp-washed-his-hands-florida-dismissal

                  • AthensHomerDawg

                    semantics? Really?” but whether he was dismissed or reached a mutual decision to part ways, it’s hard not to forgive Muschamp for taking a hard line on a player with three arrests, two for the same crime in one semester.” I think Musrat was giving him an out and an excuse. Will punted him cause he was a problem and he had depth there. You remember Quincey. Richt let him go but he was welcomed to stay. You see what i did there?

                • Cojones

                  They don’t have a rule for dismissal based on how close in time his arrests are, just in overall numbers (I think 4 times for pot). He wasn’t dismissed for pot smoking, it was for crossing swords with the coach(I don’t blame the coach) and arresting entities have nothing to do with dismissal from FU. Only the school can do that.

                  DIF was closer than you, so he gets the point AHD. By the way, I really don’t know the small shit that went into his dismissal. Just stirrin’ this pot.

                  • AthensHomerDawg

                    “uppity” and “did not follow orders”. If that is the small shit then I missed it too.

  10. Mike

    As the good Senator suggests, there might indeed be a cultural difference between younger athletes and the older generation in regards to having multiple children with multiple women outside of marriage. That said, JJ’s response about his proclivity to smoke weed suggests the young lad is not particularly self aware, or responsible for his own behavior.

    Here is his quote;

    “I was just being a college student,” he said. “I’m pretty sure there were more guys than me that smoked. I just got caught.”

    Put me in the camp that wants to see pot legalized and the penalty for smoking pot not much different than booze. That said, it is currently not legal and we all have a responsibility for our own behavior.

    • Cojones

      I’ll smoke to that! First, I have to transplant to bigger pots today. Thanks for the reminder.

      • AthensHomerDawg

        Watch your pH!

        • Cojones

          You have continued to be a good Dawg even though we step on each other’s tail from time to time. I’m glad you get the intended humor from the tweaks. Boy, I’d like to have a beer with you and others. There is an immense amount of Georgia good on this blog.

  11. Irishdawg

    It’s not so much an issue of will Jenkins be able to support those kids financially; if he gets drafted, yeah he probably will. But children NEED their father, goddammit, and having kids like they’re a litter of puppies is irresponsible, paycheck be damned. Anyone really think these kids are going to have Jenkins as a stable parental influence? Yeah, me neither.

    • JaxDawg

      There are many on here that would seem inclined to disagree, and would make excuses for ole Janoris as if he is a victim. Of what, I couldn’t possibly say. Victim of the great society perhaps.

      But you’re right Irish, a mother and a father at home raising their children in a responsible manner keeps communities, states, and nations functioning properly. Remove the family unit and replace it with the 9th cicuit court of appeal’s version and you will end up with a nation that is unidentifiable compared to the one that existed just 2 generations ago.

      • There aren’t a lot of people that take the time to comment on this blog that are going to disagree with your point of view regarding overall society and Janoris Jenkins’ reflection of it. However, the point the Senator is making, that many of you seem to be missing, is that in the context that we are discussing this, as a college football fan; we shouldn’t be so quick to act up in arms and completely write off a kid as a “thug” because he smokes weed and do our best old white man “get off my lawn” impression when these kids do these things. Whether or not you agree with the behavior or the causes of the behavior (obviously most of us here don’t), it truly is a cultural/age difference that many of us can’t relate to.

        I suppose the point I’m making is that how we go about changing that behavior that we disagree with is another discussion for another place – not a college football blog.

        • NC Dawg

          It has nothing to do with smoking weed. It’s the complete selfishness and irresponsibility of both Jenkins and the women involved. Sure, they’re victims themselves, but why keep the cycle going? Universities spend tens of thousands to bring these athletes in, hone them and train them physically, but what is being done for them emotionally, or intellectually? Keeping them eligible to play isn’t the same as helping them to learn. He think’s he’s a “great” dad? Hell, he has no idea what a great dad should even be.

          • JaxDawg

            He has no idea of what a Dad should be b/c the odds are that Janoris never knew his dad. The cycle perpetuates itself and the collateral damage continues to mount.

          • Cojones

            “Hell, he has no idea what a great dad should even be”. Sure he does: White, by the name of Tebow and at home jacking off.

        • AthensHomerDawg

          It is the off season AD.

        • It’s not just that, AD. As Jenkins points out, it’s not against the law to father a child. How many people would want Georgia to walk away from a five-star recruit whose only flaw is not keeping it in his pants and being responsible? Assuming not many, how do coaches go about dealing with talented kids who possess very different ethical values? And how do they judge which of those kids will remain viable members of the program?

          There are parts of Mark Richt’s job I don’t envy in the least.

          • NC Dawg

            I, for one, would want Georgia to walk away from a kid like that. If that makes me a Pollyanna, so be it. It is a university and I’d like to remain somewhat proud of my degree.

            • Cojones

              This is hilarious reading. Some of you need to keep cold buckets of water handy wherever you go, if you have children. Others just need one attached to their belt in case of impending emergency in a cross-cultural environment.

            • So, you think Georgia should refuse to enroll anyone who has a child out of wedlock, or just football players who’ve done so?

              How does that behavior affect your degree?

              • NC Dawg

                We’re not talking about enrolling someone. We’re talking about actively recruiting someone who exhibits a strong proclivity for reckless social behavior. Someone who probably couldn’t get into school unless he were a football player. And, yes, the fact that the school bends over and smiles for punks like this makes all of us the lesser.

                • So as long as we don’t make them feel welcome, our diplomas are still good, eh?

                  • NC Dawg

                    That’s a little strong. But so was my post. I’m realistic to know that everyone, even Richt, has to take some chances. I did stupid stuff, too, at 18. But this guy does should just a shade beyond the pale, wouldn’t you say, Sen.?

                    • I hope you don’t think I’m defending Jenkins’ behavior. My only point is that coaches like Richt have some tough calls to make, calls that we may very well have a hard time understanding.

                • NC Dawg

                  And this isn’t just a kid who has fathered a child. This is one who repeatedly does so, and brags about it. Yeah, I am not in favor of recruiting grievously bad actors, no matter how talented they are. It’s not the same to say the school shouldn’t enroll kids who makes mistakes. I don’t want us begging guys like Jenkins to grace the campus.

            • Cojones

              Knowing we can’t change what others will do and since govt-sponsored sterilization programs have gone the way of eugenics thinkers, I’m afraid us ole’ Guardians of the Society(was going to say “Guardian of the ex-Checkers”, but was afraid it wouldn’t be understood) will just have to mull along, judge as we wish to be judged and take suspicious note of certain football players on campus. That ought to be a hoot!

              We all are human and are happy to have private lives. Judging others ain’t a very interesting part of it. That hits too close to home.

              • Hackerdog

                Believing that we can’t change what others do is to believe that people don’t respond to incentives. That’s a demonstrably false assumption.

                In the past few decades, the government has subsidized illegitimacy. The unsurprising result is an explosion of illegitimate children. Who could have foreseen such a development?

            • dudetheplayer

              We better stay far away from Reuben Foster, then.

          • There are parts of Mark Richt’s job I don’t envy in the least.

            Hear hear.

            As you’ve mentioned below, people from a different “culture” (read – not young, black males with superior athletic ability) also have children out of wedlock while in college or even before college yet we aren’t so quick to argue they were a result of a larger cultural problem. I come from out in the boonies in south Augusta and knew many a kid I went to high school that had a shotgun wedding because they couldn’t keep it in their pants.

            All I’m saying is we shouldn’t be so quick to devolve into the “thugs gonna thug” argument when discussing these things.

            I have enjoyed the perspectives so far on this subject, though. As JD and Trey have pointed out, it is a sad, perpetuating cycle that folks like us are more likely to see through football players at our alma mater than in our normal everyday lives.

            • AthensHomerDawg

              Don’t know when you were born but today the boys aren’t the only ones with raging hormones.

            • NRBQ

              Hey, Audit –

              Did you go to Butler High?

              • Was zoned for Butler, went to AR Johnson. I’d like to think not going to Butler was good for me, but it likely had little impact on where I ultimately ended up in life.

                • NRBQ

                  Aw, hell. You’re a young’un then.

                  My kid went to Johnson for one year, when he was in the Honors Program.

                  When I was at Butler (ain’t saying when), no one ever heard of magnet schools.

                  Was raised on Tubman Home Road, BTW.

          • ETennDawg

            isnt that stud linebacker that moved from ga to ala the father of a 3 year old? Pretty sure there are lots of schools that would take him.

            • ScooBoo

              How many more children, with how many more mothers, has he had in the 3+ years since that child was born? We all make poor decisions at times, but making the same poor decision multiple times shows a pattern of thinking (or not thinking), that may make some not willing to invest large sums of money on you.

          • How many people would want Georgia to walk away from a five-star recruit whose only flaw is not keeping it in his pants and being responsible? Assuming not many, how do coaches go about dealing with talented kids who possess very different ethical values? And how do they judge which of those kids will remain viable members of the program?

            I, for one, want the coaches to recruit the hell out of the guy. I believe in absolute truths… like blitzing on 3rd and long. Part of the reason Mark Richt is so good in the living room is because he promises to teach young men to actually become men. Mommas like that about him. He is a father figure to the “fatherless.”

            UGA has had several players with out-of-wedlock children, and they have worked double duty to care for their families and take care of their business (school/football). Just because I don’t agree with a player’s point of view on what is normal, that doesn’t mean I don’t want him suiting up. I do want him to obey the rules (no matter how old-fashioned) once he has signed up and agreed to do so, and I would kinda like for him to learn some things about responsibility and manhood while he is at UGA… lessons many of us learned while in college. The players that make it through the program often do. Those that are resistant to that lesson have found themselves released from their scholarships.

            • And, further, I think Janoris is completely unaware that he falls into the “didn’t learn the lesson” camp even at a morally bankrupt place like Urban Meyer’s Florida regime (I’m trying to tie this back to college football). If there is a great divide, it is between Janoris and reality.

              • I’m not so sure about that.

                “No doubt, if Coach Meyer were still coaching, I’d still be playing for the Gators,” says Jenkins, a star cornerback and a potential first-round draft pick whom Muschamp booted from UF’s team after being arrested twice for possession of marijuana during the offseason. “Coach Meyer knows what it takes to win.”

                Sounds like he got the hang of one lesson quite well.

        • 81Dog

          it’s not that he smoked weed. it’s not even that he knocked some girl up (well, ok. Honk if you had Janoris Jenkins baby in Gainesville). It’s his “so what” attitude about it all. No humility. No “that may not have been the best judgment, in retrospect.” No “I’m going to do better in the future.” Just pure “kiss my ass, I’m doing great, everyone else does it, so bleeping what?”

          It’s a free county. He’s free to be a selfish ass, I’m free to disapprove. Good luck to his kids; sounds like they’ll need it.

      • JD, FYI – my last comment wasn’t directed specifically at you. More an overall comment based on the tenor of the responses thusfar.

    • James Stephenson

      Sure he will be able to afford them the 10 years he plays Pro-Ball. But what happens after that. He will be broke and those kids will have neither a father or support from him.

  12. NC Dawg

    Typical college student? Shit. Even for a spoiled jock, this guy is a walking load of manure that has no business anywhere near a college classroom, or your daughters.

  13. D.N. Nation

    I boned in college. Multiple partners. Never had a kid.

    Not to be glib, but this wasn’t all that difficult to pull off.

  14. Spike

    This attitude is another sign the apocalypse is indeed upon us.

  15. Normaltown Mike

    I had a recent consultation with a butcher, er urologist about “the surgery”. As he examined my equipment and explained to my wife it IS reversible, it occurred to me that this guy needs to be speaking at the NFL rookie symposium about how easy of a surgery it is and how much money these guys will save by not committing to 18 years of child support payments to every hot piece of action they chase.

    • AthensHomerDawg

      I don’t think that dog will hunt. Especially after the sterilization thing. Having kids is kinda like a trophy in some cultures. Proves ones manhood. ” If male, they will be in Jr. High, recruited far and wide due to the genetic traits their father gave them and leave 3 tracks when they walk.” Cojones
      Well there ya go. Kind of a caveman view from such a progressive/ smart guy IMHO. No offense.

      “Reports of Henry’s prolific procreating, generated by child-support disputes, have highlighted how futile the N.F.L.’s attempts can be at educating its players about making wise choices. The disputes have even eclipsed the attention he received after he was indicted on charges of cocaine trafficking. Three days after the telephone interview, he was jailed for falling $16,600 behind on support for a youngster in Frostproof,
      Fla., his hometown.

      “I love all my kids,” he said in the interview, but asserted he could not afford the designated amounts, estimated at $170,000 a year by Randy Kessler, his Atlanta lawyer. Kessler said Henry was virtually broke.

      “I’ve lost everything in this mess I’ve gotten myself into,” Henry said.

      • Cojones

        I hope you recognize that there is a lot of snark in these comments. The 3-track low comment was meant to antagonize those who have racially allocated penis fear. The athletic traits follow an old racial saw that goes back to slavery days. Perhaps you haven’t had the experience of viewing and hearing the N-word and other epithets at political rallys. They were meant to strike fear in the black voter(as rare as they were) and galvanize the white voter to go to the polls and vote out of their own fears.

        Marvin Griffin was famous for his racial pronunciations and he knew it. When he lost his last bid as Gov of Ga, his quote was “He just outniggered me” referring to how many times his opponent used the word. Eugene Talmadge wasn’t beyond it either. These fear tactics are still used today, only substitute the word “liberal” when you want to scare ignorant people. Fox News uses it a lot.

        • AthensHomerDawg

          Getting uptight about the word nigger is kinda silly. It’s all over the
          basketball courts and in a lot of music. It’s only racist if a Euro-American says it. (Tongue in cheek). I’ve lived all over the world . My sister is fluent in Japanese and writes some Chinese. Like you Cojones… I’ve lived in the Philippines. Guilao Hotel at Guailao point? I was called guilao in Taiwan as a kid. I have been to Chiang Kai-shek’s palace three times. Dad was with SAC. Impressive place. I lived in Okinawa and Japan. Are you familiar with gaijin? Round eye? When we finally got stateside they had closed down the black (Afro-American HS) and combined it with the white (Euro-American HS). I was new and I talked funny. I was on the outside looking in. No one wanted me… I was just different. I was also way ahead of everyone when it came to throwing a baseball. We played baseball year around in the Orient. We learned to throw junk at an early age. I was soon on the inside soon during camp. Well there ya go

          • Cojones

            My wife was born in and grew up in the Phillippines. I have never lived nor visited there. She was a Navy widow in San Diego when I met her through another Pillipino who worked on my staff in LA.

            I’m familiar with SAC since they were stationed and rotated with TAC at a nearby airbase in Sowega. I lived nearby where those commands visited on a formal basis. Subsequently, our family cultivated many friendships with Airforce people. My first great plane flight was in a two-place trainer at a local flying club and piloted by a SAC pilot who loved to fly on his days off. We have been in touch with some into their retirement years. Needless to say, this Army guy has always admired the Services and those who make them up.

        • Hackerdog

          While racial prejudice by whites against blacks is an unfortunate element of this country’s past, it is in the past.

          Nowadays, nervous people are reduced to looking in the shadows for evidence of racial conspiracies by “them.” Of course, no one uses the word “nigger” in political discourse anymore. But that’s no problem for the conspiracy theorists. Because they will simply assume that there is some surrogate word agreed upon by the conspiracy. Whether it is “liberal,” or “elm tree” doesn’t matter. Because they’ve finally found their smoking gun of hate.

          The problem is that the DaVinci Code is a work of fiction. It’s not a how-to manual for 21st century American political science. But it sure is fun to read internet comments that subscribe to its “logic.” If you take 21 paces from the Washington Monument straight toward the Smithsonian, you can dig down and find Dick Cheney’s secret copy of The Birth of a Nation. It must be there!

          • While racial prejudice by whites against blacks is an unfortunate element of this country’s past, it is in the past.

            Surely you jest. It’s not gone; it’s just mutated into more subtle forms.

            • Hackerdog

              I won’t deny that some private prejudice by whites against blacks exist. But the only governmental prejudice I see is in favor of blacks. The prejudice against blacks is so subtle that, as I stated in my post, you have to be a conspiracy theorist to find it.

              • It’s not that subtle. For instance, do you think if Martin had been the one to pull the trigger that night that the sheriff’s office would have treated him in the same way it did Zimmerman?

                • Hackerdog

                  If the initial witnesses backup up Martin’s story, very possibly. But I am confident that, had Martin been released without charges, a special prosecutor and federal investigation would not have been the result.

                  • If you think Martin wouldn’t have been hauled off to jail, you’re kidding yourself.

                    That isn’t how things work in our neck of the woods.

                    I’m not saying things haven’t improved, but we’ve still got a ways to go.

                    • Hackerdog

                      I have never said that isolated incidents can’t happen. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2100270/Scott-Henson-victim-babysitting-white-stopped-police-black-granddaughter.html
                      But the government obviously leans toward one race. When Black Panthers stand, armed, outside a polling precinct in Philadelphia, the federal government yawned. If you think Klan members standing outside a precinct in our neck of the woods would be met with the same reaction, you’re kidding yourself.

                      When the Sanford police released Zimmerman, whose story of self defense was congruent with initial eyewitness accounts, the state and federal governments stepped in. You seriously think that, had Martin been the survivor without charges, the state and federal governments would be taking over? If so, you’re kidding yourself.

                      If that’s your definition of partially colorblind, would you consider a fully colorblind government to be one that forces whites to sit at the back of the bus? Is that the ultimate goal? I hope not.

                    • You said racial incidents of whites against blacks are in the past. I didn’t read any qualifications in that, so I apologize if I misunderstood your point.

                      Henson’s backtracked on his story after the APD called him on it.

                      I can’t believe you take the Black Panther Party story seriously, but so be it. As for your Klan hypothetical, why do they need to resort to that when being inside the legislature is a far more effective way of depressing voter turnout?

                      As for Zimmerman, at a minimum, the police had their minds made up about what occurred.

                      Not sure I get your point about what constitutes colorblind government, but if there’s one area of government that isn’t colorblind, it’s the judicial system. And don’t take my word for that, take this notorious liberal’s.

      • Normaltown Mike

        thanks aristoggle. that’s reassuring.

        the doc said he could do a local and I’d stay awake or he could knock me out. I picture the local being a bit like that scene.

        • aristoggle

          It’s really not that bad. The sting from the local was probably the worst part. Except that my wife couldn’t pick me up so I had to ride my bike.

          Kidding about the bike, but I did have to get a ride from my mother-in-law. That just felt weird!

        • AthensHomerDawg

          What may happen after vasectomy?
          Any consequences of any surgery that involves the words “BLOW OUT” and “TESTICLES” gives me reason to pause. I do admire your courage and your willingness to take responsibility for birth control. I just am not convinced of the wisdom of your decision. Also, please consider your brethren who will be faced with “Mike did it….why can’t you step up!?” from their brides. I have asked friends who were considering it to “please keep that shit to yourself!” I don’t want to have to deal with it. LOL

          “There’s a big possibility that a blow-out may occur during post vasectomy period. Here’s the thing- an average man produces about 85 million sperm cells a day. Since there’s no more way out, the sperms will remain in the testicles until such time they get absorbed by the body. As the testicles continue to produce sperm cells, the sealed cords or deferens may swell up and burst and they may just go anywhere and leak to body cavities. Since this condition is not natural, the body releases antibodies as its defense mechanism which unfortunately reacts negatively with the sperm cells, leading to severe complications.

          Majority of men who undergone vasectomies complain about the pain and discomfort they experience after the procedure. Normally, the pain will continue for a week or so and will eventually subside but there are times that it won’t go away. In that case, it’s no longer normal. It is important to see a doctor especially if the pain becomes more intense than usual. There could be an underlying problem that triggers the pain.frequent vasectomy side effects

          In addition to the pain, men may experience the feeling of fullness in their testicles. Since there’s no longer an outlet for the sperms, this is a common symptom. The sperms produced by the testicles will stay in the epididymis (the tube that connects the testicles to the vas deferens) until absorbed by the body. It may takes several weeks for that to happen and can even be longer ……”

          • Normaltown Mike

            I’ve got three kids and can’t afford the one’s I’ve got so I’m taking a calculated risk. However, I like that your post ended on a high note!

            “It may …. even be longer “

            • AthensHomerDawg

              LOL. Three is a great number. I was set on that number until my bride overruled me. I had visions of Ponderosa and Ben Cartwright. However, my wonderful bride informed me after delivering out second son that If I continued my “Bonanza/Ben Cartwright” daydream …. I too would be single and free to pursue it. We are still happily married.
              (two kids).

            • Cojones

              Had it done in the 70s while my wife was pregnant with our 3rd child. Done in the afternoon, an icebag was kept on the area for most of the evening. Got up early the next morning and kept an icebag on it while driving my family from the Ozarks to Chicago. I had no thoughts of sexual freedom, but rather it was a conscious decision to limit my ability to place anymore beings on this overpopulated earth. Had put it off and was going to adopt a little girl since my first two were boys and family enough(at that time the population figures of the world were exponential and no longer arithmetic, showing responsible family children numbers to be slightly over two) but the lovely accident of my daughter prevailed.

              Began the drive on Sat and went to work on Mon. No problems then or ever. Course, my dick fell off.

              • Normaltown Mike

                Do you still have an interest in fertility issues? If so, what are your thoughts on the cratering fertility rates in most of the developed world (outside the US and a very few others)?

                • Cojones

                  Fertility has never been an issue to me. It is the birth rate. The earth will only handle so many mouths and room for excrement. All of those issues affect us (enough food and pollution) through birth rate.

                  During the 60s, at UGA, we had many conversations about those issues plus what we can do individually to control them. One topic concerned the available room for burial using ground that would be needed for other purposes. By projecting the birth rate vs room for burial, at that time , we would run up against legislation needed in the future to regulate the usage of the earth’s surface before it vanished for use by the living. That is why, long ago, I stipulated to be cremated because the process returns elements immediately back to earth and doesn’t take up burial room.

                  UGA had lively environmental discussions and I remember the first Earth Day celebration in Sanford Stadium with posters and exhibits all over the playing field. And I remember my wife and I finding ourselves in front of the world population scenario projected graphically upward some 12 ft. As we gazed up, she was 8 mos with our first child who was born within the next month at St Mary’s. It was fodder for a worldwide photo, but no one took it.

                  Some years later, I worked for a company that specialized in birth control. Nowadays there are so many ways to conceive and control conceiving that ignorance is no excuse when making that choice. It’s up to the conscience of the individual. Thank God we don’t know how to control individual conscience, but education helps. Those who let theocrats determine how they think about birth and fertility are part of that choice.

                  Is this a great fucking country , or what? Pun intended and was overdue on this blog.

          • Dog in Fla

            “men may experience the feeling of fullness in their testicles.”

            Prospective patients who are already blessed with ball fullness should consult with their urologist to ensure the availability of a medical appliance sling before electing the procedure

            http://gifattack.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/lebowski_bowling.gif

  16. Aligator

    I can’t wait until this draft is over so one of Urbs last headaches can shut his dumb ass the fuck up.

  17. JaxDawg

    What hasn’t been mentioned is that for every Janoris Jenkins or Travis Henry, there are thousands of males who do the same, day in – day out. The difference is that they have no NFL paycheck to offset their reckless screwing/damage. They grow up without a father or a father figure and to them, having children out of wedlock and moving from one whore to the other is totally acceptable. If you were to frame this story to in the context of science, people would think you were talking about animals. Seriously.

    I consider Bill Cosby a hero for his views on education and personal responsibility. The problem is that many of the people he is talking to refuse to listen. And we all suffer from the consequences of their stupidity and ignorance.

    • Cojones

      Yeah, I thought those Hollywood people would never stop having kids out of wedlock. I’m not sure Angelina and Brad got Bill’s message in time and …..Oh Shit!….. they’re looking at each other again!

    • CoastToCoast

      Not condoning anyone’s behavior here, but I think you can pump the breaks with the “whore” talk.

    • wnc dawg

      Good Lord people. Those arguments haven’t been mentioned b/c this is A CFB BLOG. Go read the HuffPo or National Review if you want those arguments hashed out. Does anyone hear really care what others consider a family unit, or the value of a particular makeup of said unit? I sure don’t. Can we keep it to how this relates to why we come to this site- cfb in general and uga in particular?

      Sorry for engaging in these rants, but it just seems people are taking much more liberty lately in enlightening us with their views on race, politics, et al instead of football.

  18. Cojones

    There is a program begun in the NFL by a former NFL Coach who has teamed up with Richt to bring the responsibility message to college kids(athletes). There are people out there giving societal concerns more than the lip service we give on here. Trey and Dawgfan Will are excluded from that comment.

  19. NC Dawg

    The proclivity for single-mom births already transcends racial lines. It’s Jenkins’ irresponsibility, not his race, that rankles. Again, I was way too arrogant at 18, and I was irresponsible about many things. But …

  20. CarolinaDawg

    I could honestly care less if someone is married when they have a kid. People get divorced after a child is born and don’t pay child support, as well. What I care about is having to foot the bill for someone else’s child. Normaltown, if this surgery is reversible, then can we please snip guys who fail to pay child support? You get caught up, and we reverse it.

  21. NC Dawg

    I worry more about the child. Someone who fathers one should be man enough to stick around and help rear the child. That’s a father.

  22. WFdawg

    Senator, for the record you should file “Paternal Ethics Discussions” under “Offseason Gold,” just behind “Nostalgic Reminiscences of Sanford Stadium.” This post has legs.

  23. JaxDawg

    Just to liven up the discussion a bit and b/c our liberal/socialist friends on here hate to see this shit, I submit exhibit # 9,146,844, a video by Alexandra Pelosi (Nancy’s daughter).

  24. Macallanlover

    It’s generational, it is cultural, and it is racial as well. And that isn’t racist, or bigoted, it is factual. Deal with it.