The great thing about this post is how utterly routine it manages to make the topic sound.
Filed under Nick Saban Rules, Recruiting
“I’ve been a vocal opponent of the oversigning.com crowd for a while, but to be honest, when the numbers start to get this loose, our position starts to creep towards being untenable.”
If their position is starting to creep towards being untenable, I would hate to see an untenable position.
He’s simply whistling past the graveyard of cut Bama players and made a mistake of accidentally glancing at the additional holes that are slotted to be dug.
Finagling the numbers and pulling scholarships is something Nick Saban has time for.
Oh yeah, we’re gonna be 6 or 8 over. No problem. We’ll just cut a few. Ho hum.
It’s Tuscaloosa. Forget it Jake.
That’s an awful way to treat kids…I hope it’s no a common practice (esp. at UGA).
..And how wonderful it is that not one has flunked out! 85 (or more) kids on football scholarships and they ALL are passing!
Is there a Jan Kemp in Tuscaloosa?
You can be sure of that — note the half dozen plus walkons given scholarships two years ago. Pretty much the opposite end of the spectrum, and although what they are doing is bad, what we’ve done isn’t exactly good. Part good (not willing to oversign or even cut it close on numbers) and part lazy (just not bothering to recruit contributors even when we have clearly open slots).
Bama fans do not care.
All you have do is read their comments. They have an answer (excuse) for everything. Pretty pathetic.
Ignorance is truly bliss.
I keep waiting for the recruits to wake up to this nonsense, but it doesn’t seem to be happening. Everyone thinks they are invincible and destined for super stardom. They don’t bother to consider whether the program will continue to invest in them if they get hurt, don’t turn into superstars, etc. Most will go pro in something else… or so I’ve been told.
In a weird way, I think it actually helps their recruiting. Bama spins it as “this place is for the best of the best, come prove that you are one of the best”. Remember how invincible we all thought we were when we were 18, even if recruits see guys essentially being cut for not panning out, they’re going to think “Yeah but that won’t happen to me, I’ll be too good for them to cut”. None of these recruits ever think they would be one of the ones to fail, I don’t think it factors into their minds at all. Which is hard to imagine when you look at it as an adult, but 18 year old kids who have been told by everybody for the last few years how great they are just don’t look at it the same way we do.
“None of these recruits ever think they would be one of the ones to fail, I don’t think it factors into their minds at all. Which is hard to imagine when you look at it as an adult,” where failure is always an option :)
Of course not. These are not just 17-year-old kids, but kids who get calls from recruiting “experts” after every college visit, and get “signing ceremonies” televised live on ESPN. Of course it won’t happen to them.
Which is why the NCAA should allow the kids representation before they sign.
Cold blooded bastards, those Bammers.
“vocal opponent of the oversigning.com crowd for a while”
Because no Oversigning Cup has been awarded since 2011 (followed by radio silence since August 6, 2011), I thought the oversigning.com crowd had either settled with and/or been terminated with prejudice by the Deciders
If you read the linked blog I beg of you not to read the comments below it. I have temporarily lost all faith in humanity.
+1. I didn’t think the article was that bad, but the comments are ruthless.
I haven’t read through, but I quit perusing RBR a few years ago. They could be talking about nuclear strategies in Iran and inevitably the comments would devolve into talking down about Richt and Georgia. Not that they aren’t entitled to their opinion (there’s a reason they get compared to assholes), but it just got old that every post turned into Richt-bashing for no apparent reason.
Sadly, there is a pretty apparent reason if you look at the percent of Bama students that grew up in Georgia and have the ubiquitous “doesn’t test well” condition.
And this is why comparing UGA/Richt to Bama/Saban is illogical, though I agree we should never end up at 69 and blame it on refusal to oversign.
Yeah its pretty bad the way those kids are being talked about.
But i also agree the NCAA could do a LOT to curb this stuff if it cared enough to do so.
I like the 23-25 Scholarships per year number, and if they don’t make it then tough stuff.
Either way i’m guessing the coming splitting off of the Have-Nots may change a lot in the way of how this all works anyways.
“So here’s the final tally – if we(ALABAMA) sign 27 (and they all qualify academically), Bama will basically have to cut eight guys that don’t have their degrees yet. I want to emphasize that there really isn’t any wiggle room here. No amount of backcounting/sleight of hand helps with these final numbers. Unless some of the 16 unenrolled current commits are going to take a greyshirt (and not sign on national signing day), those slots will have to come from the current roster.”
That is quite the roster cut AL is looking at. It will be a fun summer there.
A lot of talk about how many QB’s and RB’s will need to be cut to make the number. I hope the recruits are reading this. They never do as it never means them.
And how many of those Grey Shirts really make the AL roster? It just seems to blow up a kids playing career for nothing. They get to pay for the privilege of being a tackling dummy at Al when they could have gotten a full rider anywhere else. Not bright.
Except at UT. There they would still be tackling dummies, tackling other orange dummies.
Is there any history of reporters asking Saban which players are going to get cut at a signing day conference? Or who’s at risk of losing their scholarship with a bad spring practice?
Or even better, which eight players he expects to transfer for personal reasons this summer?
Now that would be a presser I’d like to see!
God, please let this happen. Can we plant a reporter to ask the question? Maybe that kid in Gainesville that got his as chewed by Uberdouche Meyer.
The NCAA should not have to solve this problem, our conference office gave lip service to the issue 2-3 years ago and could remedy the problem immediately, yet not a word is uttered from ANYONE within the league office. Unfortunately the issue does not provide an opportunity for Mike Slive to stand in front of a camera and smile while holding a big check. I do not think it is too much to ask that the SEC office utilize a fraction of te money’s collected to develop an enforcement department to address the wide variance in such issues. The League office could publish the absolute number of scholarship spots for each school during the festivities at the Championship game, then revise the numbers after the deadline for draft eligibility in early January of each year. Like a lot of issues, none of the athletic directors in the SEC want to push these issues, so the schools that continuously operate with one foot over the line are given more incentive to continue to act in that manner.
For those with more details on the subject please clarify, once signed is the letter of intent the equivalent (in terms of NCAA counting) of a scholarship, or is the scholarship executed when the player report to campus?
What needs to happen is to have a player who is doing everything right (or a couple) but that hasn’t cracked the starting lineup raise holy hell (in a respectful well thought out manner) in the press and go very public about it. Make it a PR nightmare for Saban by putting a face to it. It won’t correct the problem but it would be fun to watch and might hurt them somewhat with the next class or two.
Oversigning and cutting are inevitable consequences of scholarship caps and one-year scholarships. Don’t blame Saban for being rational, blame the folks who put that system in place.
The easiest way to solve the problem would be to eliminate scholarship caps. Who the hell is the NCAA to tell [player #86] that he can’t get a scholarship from the school of his choice?
The same folks who tell him he can’t trade on his name, for one.
That’s like saying theft is an INEVITABLE consequence of an unlocked door. Maybe true, but some folks choose to steal and others don’t.
That’s why you lock the door WD. If you don’t, someone will steal. Locking the door helps keep the potential bad guy from doing bad things. Temptation.
Of course. My point is that calling a theft inevitable doesn’t mean that the person who steals is any less a thief. If oversigning is inevitable, that doesn’t mean coaches who sell kids on a 4-year dream and then find ways to get them off the team aren’t assholes.
So, a thief is still a thief even if he doesn’t steal, is that what you’re saying?
Scholarship caps were introduced to give the kids more power. Unfortunately, oversigners have abused the rule and just cut kids through medical redshirts, discipline, or encouraged transfers. The idea was that you couldn’t sign more than 85. The enforcement is that you can’t have more than 85 when you start fall camp. That gives enough wiggle room to drive a Mack truck through.
Create a scholarship count on the day before signing day. Declare how many you have open, and sign no more than that. Any spots that come open before fall camp can only be filled through a transfer or on the next signing day without regard to a total number you can sign at a time. You can sign up to the number you have available whether that is 15 or 35, so long as you declare the scholarship players before signing day. If you want to give a walk-on a scholarship, they have to have been on your team the previous year (so, no true freshmen walk-ons getting scholarships).
Bama, and others, sign an entire EXTRA class more than Georgia does every four years. It is a huge edge, when added to the different discipline standards we face, the whole “underachieving” stigma gets exposed. SEC and NCAA needs to step up on the over signing issue, shame to have the Big? show more integrity than the SEC but at least they agreed to be men about it. I don’t think Bama fans realize how close they are to looking like Auburn with this strategy. We all like to win, but only some are willing to throw athletes to the curb to get an advantage. Truth is, Alabama coulod be pretty good even if they stopped acting like this.
Contrast this story with the story from a few days ago about Dodd having Tech leave the SEC because other teams were essentially over signing and cutting players and the conference doing nothing about it…. The more things change, the more they stay the same….
Alabama, where football players are a ‘piece of meat.”
No one cries when a high school kid is cut from the team. No one hammers on about the injustice of an NFL player being cut. Heck, no one cries when little Johnny fails to make his local travel baseball team. Why do some stress over the fact that college kids get cut? I find this silly. Saban and Alabama are playing within the rules. On the very edge of the rules, but inside none the less. We bemoan the fact that the Dawgs have a down year (too many as of late), yet we appauld Richt for recruiting in the same manner for 13 years now. He never oversigns, often times leaving open scholarships on the table. Yet we struggle to understand why the Dawgs have never player for the BCS title. Oh, I know it is merely luck. Maybe a key injury or 2. What about the SEC officials and their conspiracy to keep the Dawgs down? I fully realize the Richt’s inability to fully utilize the 85 scholarship limit to the programs greatest advantage has zero to do with recent down falls (sarcasm fully intended re this sentence). I just fail to understand why a free college education is deemed a right by many.
It’s not a right, but it should be a two-way commitment. I might feel okay about players being cut if they were still allowed to keep their scholarships if they made the grades, or if they could immediately transfer to a school that would have them and play without sitting a year.
The HS kid who gets cut doesn’t have to quit school.
In today’s SEC, when you lose playing against a stacked deck, you still get paid.
Not as much as the winners, but you still walk away with more money than you had, regardless of how much you ante up.
Butts-Mehre and North Campus are quite content with this arrangement.
I realize that’s probably the most popular Alabama blog on the ‘net, but there’s a lot of fail in that article.
A couple of points:
* Nothing I’ve read on the paid sites suggest Alabama signs 26 or 27. Could happen, but all I’ve read is 25.
There are a couple of guys in the 2014 class that may not be eligible to play.
There are 12 guys on the roster with degrees in hand. 12, not 2.
I’m pretty sure this guy doesn’t know how many were on scholarship last year. I remember hearing rumors during the season that the full 85 were not used.
If a guy is going to post stuff like that y’all for sure trash it. I just don’t think the post is very accurate. (As far as the comments, what can I say?)
Truth is not a requirement if you are criticizing Saban. Just throw some negative comment out there. If you can’t win on the field, baffle them with bullshit.
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