Even as I don’t agree with everything contained in the statement released by the Oklahoma football players about the by now infamous racist chant of members of a university fraternity (expelling the frat boys for speech is a First Amendment violation, in my view), I can’t help but be impressed by the amount of thought that went into the student-athletes expressing their sentiments.
Still, I can’t help but wonder about something they’ve said.
…We have not practiced this week, and will not be practicing today as we will demonstrate silently on Owen Field during our normal practice time. We will not forget about this during spring break, and upon our return to the practice field on Monday, March 23, we will continue to address this issue in our media opportunities and by wearing black during our practices. We cannot express how grateful we are to Coach Stoops and the coaching staff for supporting each and every action we have taken, even when these actions may have seemed extreme. We simply cannot wait to get back on the practice field in our pursuit of a national championship, but even a national championship is not more important than using our platform as student athletes to make our university and our nation a better place…
Again, the sentiment is admirable and Coach Stoops deserves plenty of credit for giving his players the opportunity to explain themselves, but I can’t help but compare this situation with the one surrounding Northwestern’s unionization vote. More particularly, about how that sat with Pat Fitzgerald, the coach:
“I don’t think any team dealt with a bigger distraction than we did a year ago. We dealt with it fine, but I think it hurt our team’s performance on the field. Why do I feel that way? It’s a huge allocation of time. We only have so many hours to be with the guys, and we were taking the time to educate them on situations that had nothing to do with football. For me, that’s the biggest tragedy for those seniors. Tragedy is a hard word, but that group will never get that time back. I look at a guy like Trevor who had a lot put on his shoulders. He and I haven’t spoken about it, but I’m assuming his tank was on empty by the time he got to the season.”
Somehow, I’m guessing that if anybody’s referring to what’s happened at Oklahoma as tragedy, it’s not being directed at the football players, even though these are both “situations that had nothing to do with football“. But if your standard is what Fitzgerald says it is in evaluating the activity, how are the two situations any different, particularly if you’re part of the “You can’t have the animals running the zoo in a college education” crowd? Either way, preparation time is being taken away from the seniors, time they’ll never get back.
Right? Or could it have been about something other than allocating time?
Like I said, I’m just wonderin’.
Get The Picture 
In both situations it’s a choice made by the players to spend their time in a more meaningful and personal way than football. I am guessing that the Northwestern players will look back on that time with pride, and remember it more fondly than they would winning an extra game or two. The Oklahoma players wrote in that statement that what they’re doing now is more important to them than a national championship, indicating that they are aware of the potential cost and are willing to pay the price. I admire that.
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+1
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Agree.
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Sticks and Stones rhyme is just not PC anymore, huh?
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Sticks and stones. As a kid who was teased endlessly in elementary school for a wandering eye, I remember thinking the first time I ever heard it how completely wrong that rhyme was. Still do.
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I think it fits myself…was always taught not to worry about what someone says. People have been teasing each other since the beginning of time…
Sorry about your eye…
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Ideas become words become actions. Words precede sticks and stones. Yes, you have to judge if the words are harmless or not – but if you’re going to toss those words out there, then you don’t also get to decide if they are harmful or not.
“Words can never…” They often do. That’s why I hate the rhyme. Sometimes you move on and ignore the words, but often you can’t or shouldn’t.
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I view the expulsion as a favor. Those young men would be getting their asses kicked on the regular were they to return to campus and classes.
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There are racist ignorant idiots on every campus and thank goodness they like to congregate together. It makes them easier to spot but at some point you just have to get back to what you do. What are the OU players trying to accomplish? Have the students stopped going to class? Have the stores rolled up the sidewalks and stopped doing business? The SAE boys are idiots and deserve to be ostracized by their community and their classmates at OU. I also believe that you should not be able to kick them out of school for exercising their first amendment rights and that includes and guarantees their right to say stupid sh#$ as long as they are not directly threatening people.
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I would think that many people would hear “hang ’em on a tree” as threatening. Overt racism, especially referencing lynching, is threatening to other students on campus.
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I always thought that freedom of speech meant freedom from prosecution (barring things like slander), NOT freedom from consequences of said speech. They were free to say what they said; the OU prez was free to discipline them for it. But then, I’m not a lawyer, so I’m sure the JDs aboard will weigh in with all the legal nuances.
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Amen. You’re not free to yell “I have a bomb” at the airport either. You participate in hate speech and racist threats, then you deserve to be kicked out school. You can kick kids out of public high school for making sexual threats. I’ve seen it happen to a kid in my neighborhood.
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There is a pretty substantial amount of case law on freedom of speech as it applies to college campuses and it is a different animal there. I am sure that many will come down on both sides and have valid arguments on both sides. That will be for the courts to decide. Understand I am not defending what they said by any stretch of the imagination but first amendment rights at a public institution……..is a lot trickier than “they should get this or I feel like they mean that”. It is the first amendment for a reason.
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Agree. Ostracize them all you want (and deservedly so), but you can’t expel them. Huffpo did a pretty good job of outlining relevant case law: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/geoffrey-r-stone/racist-rants-and-the-univ_b_6844500.html
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This is probably why Boren didn’t say they were being expelled for their words–he said they were being expelled for their actions: “playing a leadership role” in what would likely be termed by the university’s code of conduct as “creating a hostile learning environment” (also Boren’s words). Conduct detrimental to learning is much more broad and can certainly include the content of speech in a certain context (Boren used the word “threatening” more than once, and that is difficult to argue given the graphic nature of the words).
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“Boren used the word “threatening” more than once, and that is difficult to argue given the graphic nature of the words”
I agree with everything you said except for this part. I don’t think anyone felt legitimate fear for their safety after watching the video.
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It’s not about the immediate safety of people on the bus, man. Geez.
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I know that. But when you watched that video, did you honestly feel like there was a chance they were going to actually lynch someone? I saw some bigoted college kids showing their asses, but not people who would likely do anyone physical harm. YMMV, of course.
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Doesn’t really matter what I think, does it? The point is that one group of students is threatening–yes, threatening–violence against another group of students. Call if PC if you want, but given the history of attitudes towards blacks in this country, it can’t really be tolerated. (Unless you want to have no black applicants the following year.)
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“but given the history of attitudes towards blacks in this country”
So because the frat boys share the same skin color as people who did bad things, they should receive different punishment? Sounds pretty racist to me.
And there were no direct threats no matter how you try to spin it. What they said was very wrong and insensitive, but it wasn’t threatening.
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Actually to the Supreme Court it is about an immediate threat or a perceived direct threat to an individual or group. The y don’t and shouldn’t care about the makeup of applicants to a university. I think OU will lose this if it goes to court. seems like you think that because it would be divisive that they wouldn’t rule in their favor. I think it’s a done deal for a district federal judge. Pretty cut and dry. I have a feeling we are going to find out.
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100% Agree. We can disagree with what they said while still acknowledging that the first amendment gives them the right to say it.
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Certainly, you barristers each have a way to prosecute or defend the SAE students who were dismissed from school. Why can’t you yell “Fire!” in a crowded theater? Because of the possibility of panic and physical harm. “The possibility” means many things to many people, but each individual event will likely be judged independently, but the overall caution remains the same, doesn’t it? Most states have laws concerning physical abuse and yep, that’s pretty cut and dried, but did you know that some states have the same punishment for verbal abuse? That includes language leading to physical abuse, OR NOT. Stand-alone verbal abuse(a challenge in a bar that insults a person or their family) that doesn’t end in physical abuse falls under verbal abuse prosecution in some states. About 4yrs ago a friend in Cairo told me that his uncle in Fl was prosecuted for verbal abuse toward another man and convicted. I looked it up at the time and I think the statute was 744 (too lazy to look it up again). Of course Fl has a gun-toting law about “fear of imminent danger toward your life” that permits a nervous drink in some bars down there or it can be used by racists who fear another race because of prior prejudices as has already been sensationalized on national tv.
Good, bad or otherwise, we tend to continue to make laws that can be used unfairly toward one race or another. Could a black person feel threatened on the OU campus and shoot a guy wearing an SAE pin? Probably couldn’t be defended there, but what if it happened in Fl? The perp would probably have the same chance to be convicted if he was black, said he was on a neighborhood watch and shot a “suspicious acting” white guy he “tussles” with before killing him. How many of you thinks the black guy walks in Fl?
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“How many of you thinks the black guy walks in Fl?”
That depends. Was the victim always white or did he become white overnight to fuel controversy? Also, did the “perpetrator” call 911 beforehand (which is pretty much the last thing anyone would do before instigating a fight).
In all seriousness, Cojones, everyone knows that free speech is limited. Some of us just don’t think those limitations apply in this instance. Did you read the relevant case law discussed in the article I linked to earlier? I mean, if huffpo is going against the liberal PC crowd, you KNOW something’s not right…
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Of course the OU football players have no issue with welcoming back Joe Mixon, who yelled a gay slur at a woman’s male companion and then punched that woman and broke several bones in her face. All on video of course.
So they are outraged about the culture that would allow for a racist chant, not outraged by the culture that would allow one of them to rape a woman (Frank Shannon) or beat a woman and yell gay slurs (Joe Mixon) and still be allowed to attend the University of Oklahoma and play football at Oklahoma.
So songs/chants of violence can not be tolerated, actual real physical violence against women and slurs against gays, totally tolerable.
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Lookie here, we agree 😉
Bigotry, violence, and rape are all fine and dandy so long as it’s not a successful, straight, white male doing it. If so, then even speaking of it in general terms is literally the biggest deal ever.
What the OU players are doing will have zero impact on anything except their own feelings of self righteousness.
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The successful, straight, white male is certainly persecuted and oppressed. Sure, we’re over-represented in government, under-represented in prisons, get the best jobs, get paid more for the same jobs, and are free to walk down the street or drive a car without being pulled over for “looking suspicious.” Other than that, though, we’ve got it rough.
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red-herring for the win! Can you name one instance, just one, of a black person being publicly shamed and/or disciplined for using derogatory language about white people? Dawgphan mentioned quite a few things the OU football players are ok with, and all of them are a whole lot worse than someone saying the word “nigger”
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Just one? Okay.
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Senator, that did happen when he was 5, so maybe he gets a pass on that one.
He is a child that thinks it is edgy to say bad words.
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Oh and 165, we dont agree. Not even a little.
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And now you’re back to your usual trolling attempts. That didn’t take long
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In a country of 300M+, I was confident there would be at least one instance. The fact that you had to go back over two decades for an example is amusing though
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I’m not the one who emphasized just one. That was you, right?
Why does it take that to validate the Oklahoma kids’ feelings, anyway?
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Yes, it was me. I was replying to papadawg and I don’t think he could’ve named even one without your help.
The OU players don’t need me to validate their opinions. As DP pointed out though, they are conveniently overlooking far more serious transgressions from their own teammates. Overlooking real cases of violence and sexual assault but making a big deal out of racial slurs is not a net gain for society. One is far, far worse than the other (even though the frat boys actions were, indeed, repulsive).
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So why even ask “Can you name one instance, just one, of a black person being publicly shamed and/or disciplined for using derogatory language about white people?” in the first place?
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Like I said, I was replying to papadawg. He wouldn’t have been able to without significant research. I didn’t anticipate you caring enough to respond 😉
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It’s not about who you were asking. It’s about why. And it doesn’t sound like you want to answer.
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How many instances of a white person making a racial slur have resulted in (well deserved) negative repercussions over the past year or so? And you had to go back over two decades to give one instance of the reverse. Shouldn’t we treat all of these situations equally as opposed to doling out more criticism and/or punishment based on the race of the person saying it? Of course we should, but we don’t. That’s why I asked the question, to point out the obvious double standard.
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On what basis are you making the assumption that I don’t know what I’m talking about? Because my opinion is different than yours?
For all you know, I could be an expert on topics such as systemic racism as well as argumentation in the public square. If that were true, I would probably point out that you were incorrect about the red herring fallacy [all those things I mentioned were very relevant your comment], but present a nice example of a hasty generalization. 😉
I realize that arguing this topic in the comments of a college football site is unlikely to get us anywhere. I’m just a sucker for the persecution myth.
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To be clear, I don’t think whites are the victims of racism to the extent blacks are in America. I just think there’s a double standard with situations like these.
You’re flat out wrong about “paid more for the same job” though:
http://www.justfacts.com/racialissues.asp#income
For women:
1) Black women with high school diplomas earn 3% more income than white women with high school diplomas.
2) Black women with some college education earn 6% more income than white women with some college education.
3) Black women who are college graduates earn 7% more income than white women who are college graduates.
For men:
4) Comparing people with similar math, verbal, and reading skills, black men earned 9% more than white men
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165, none of of those stats you cited from that article published 15 years ago (based on a census from 1994) compare salaries in the same job.
This article, from 2014, compares people doing the same job: http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2014/10/09/high-tech-pay-gap-hispanics-asians-african-americans/16606121/
“In the same high-skilled positions such as computer programmers and software developers, Asians make $8,146 less than whites and blacks $3,656 less than whites, according to the report from the American Institute for Economic Research.”
I don’t think I’m wrong about wages for the same job. [and I could add in A LOT about access to those jobs, to education, etc.] But even if I were wrong on pay, it wouldn’t change my points about representation in gov’t, prison, etc.
And in your original post that I replied to, you included violence and rape as things that are fine and dandy as long as they’re committed by someone other than a straight, white male. I don’t think there’s any reasonable way that you can defend that position. I agree that the issues with the OU football players are serious and awful, but they’re not getting away with it because they’re black. It’s because they can play ball.
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When I said fine and dandy I meant according to the football team considering how little protest they made about those situations. Ironic because if the football players made this big of a deal about stuff like that they’d probably actually make a difference in who Stoops recruits moving forward. Not to sound insensitive, but I don’t think what they’re doing is going to accomplish much. The frat has been suspended and members have been expelled. In other words, it’s already been proven that OU isn’t tolerating it.
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Not alright to use the N-word regardless of the point you are trying to make.
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His willingness to use it speaks volumes. Not that he cares, I’m sure….one of those “I’m not a racist/people are just too sensitive” types.
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You guys are pathetic. I’m racist because I admit that rape and actual violence is worse than someone saying “nigger” to no specific person in particular, and I spelled out the word instead of saying “the N word?” So there’s never, ever a time when a white person can say the word without you assigning a negative label? That implication alone sounds pretty bigoted 😉
Yeah, I guess I’m one of the “people are too sensitive” types. Get over yourselves.
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What was the mist heinous thing to happen in OKC in the past 20 years?
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Literally every thing that comes out of your stupid mouth makes everybody on this thread hate you that much more. You realize that, right? Nobody here likes you and nobody respects what you have to say. Because you spew words like a backwoods idiot.
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I really haven’t paid much attention to who says what on this board. I just respond to posts I find interesting but dude don’t throw out that school yard bully bullshit on someone like we all got together and Decided we hate someone. You don’t speak for me because I don’t know much about this guy and his posts. Somebody vote you president of the cool kids?
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Agreed.
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I don’t live to be the cool kid on a (mostly) anonymous message board. I enjoy a nice debate so I throw in my $0.02 regardless of whether it will get people’s panties in a wad or not. When people like you respond with nothing but insults it actually makes me feel like I’m bringing up some inconvenient truths that people don’t want to acknowledge or talk about, so thanks for that 🙂
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“Literally every thing that comes out of your stupid mouth makes everybody on this thread hate you that much more. ”
What a stupid, overly-emotional statement. Are you 12 years old?
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Re; you being racist “because [you] admit that rape and actual violence than someone saying [those things I really don’t want to say], that’s not what I said at all. I think rape and violence is worse. I think there is a double-standard for football players, hell yes. I also think that people who toss that word around that casually are either African-Americans being very casual with the language or non-African-Americans being very casual about race relations. Am I saying that you are very casual about race relations? Based on all your comments herein, absolutely.
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“His willingness to use it speaks volumes”
Not sure what you meant by this then.
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As to this–“So there’s never, ever a time when a white person can say the word without you assigning a negative label?…I guess I’m one of the ‘people are too sensitive” types,’ yes, pretty much. Guess I had you pegged after all, huh?
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The only reason these guys are allowed to attend the University is because they are good at football.
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Great open discussion except for a little childish name calling. Careful DawgPhan and 165, you are bringing up valid points which people don’t really want to hear. I’m a white anglo-saxon protestant college educated heterosexual and have worked hard for everything I have. I belong to the one group that is okay to insult. But that’s okay, people are people and there are plenty of douchbags to go around. The high quality of the discussion on this blog is really amazing. (no sarcasm)
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The white man’s burden. I’ve always loved this train of thought.
Tell me, what group would you like to trade places with so that you wouldn’t have to put up with being insulted?
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Yes. the burden of being in charge. In free countries it’s always ok to speak negatively of the majority (which is, by its majority-ness, the dominant class/culture). It’s sometimes called speaking truth to power.
There are places where you really can’t do that, though. I’m sure you can name a few.
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No gastr1, it’s never acceptable to pick on someone or treat them differently due to race. Period. End of story.
Amazing that anyone thinks otherwise… Simply mind boggling.
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Well, you’re exactly right, it isn’t acceptable, it’s a damn fact of life. Racism, sexism, and religious discrimination are present within cultures, governments, and institutions without intent to do so. There is nothing as powerful as actually being a minority–in a foreign country/in a place where you are the only one of your kind, whatever that is–to illustrate the principle of the unintended oppressiveness of majorities. There is little recourse for minorities except to remind the majority of how they act toward everyone else, intended or not.
But note that you used the “n” word and I did not bandy about a similar slur about white folks. So there’s that. You abused your power. I didn’t abuse mine. That’s what makes our actions different despite our beliefs.
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So you’re still claiming a moral high ground because you said “N word?” Get over yourself.
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As a white person myself, I don’t expect respect. I have power instead. That’s the cost and reward of being in the majority. I do get moral high ground over other white people that abuse their power by treating non-whites disrespectfully–especially the ones who expect treatment given to them that they don’t give others. So, yes. You want to be fair? Recognize that words have power, that power is only minimally and reluctantly shared, and that in this country you have the power. Stop abusing it by being disrespectful of others while expecting respect yourself.
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“white people that abuse their power by treating non-whites disrespectfully”
Please show me where I’ve objectively disrespected non-whites. Thanks.
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Meant to direct that comment as a reply to Gurkha, sorry.
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Hey, Gurka, thanks for that information. Does this mean there are white people it is NOT ok to insult? Like if they are not Wasps? Just a thought, man, but maybe the reason its ok to insult Wasps is that Wasps are generally in leadership roles in most cases of bigotry, racial intolerance and religious persecution in this country and others.
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“but maybe the reason its ok to insult Wasps is that Wasps are generally in leadership roles in most cases of bigotry”
So it’s ok to insult someone because someone who shares their skin color does/did offensive things? Got it.
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It is Gurkha who says it is ok to insult WASPs…not me.
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Yeah, ok.
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My oldest son and I rented a movie during his Senior yr in HS. It was about a white kid who got a scholly to a university by staining himself and passing for black. While it was meant to be a comedy, there were serious life lessons buried, some in the jokes that were told by white students in the college. There were times when the star was in the library and whispering resulted in group laughter from whites looking at him. My son and I turned the audio up full volume and the whispering was actually jokes in the script. Examples of these jokes have stayed with us both as ironic jokes that elicit laughter without thinking and they were as seriously racist as using the epithet “nigger” to indicate a person with black skin color:
Question: What do you call a white guy who is surrounded by 10 black guys?
Answer: “Quarterback”
Question: What do you call a white guy surrounded by 1000 black guys?
Answer: “Warden”
These were from the movie, but you can easily make your own ironic racial jokes without using the epithet( one white guy in a black history class would be called “Professor” , etc.). I didn’t type this to be able to legitimately use a racial epithet or use shared humor. The point was well made to my teenage son, so, considering that most of you don’t have a teenage mind and have wiser years to separate you, then you should be able to associate hurtful subtle humor into racism without anyone having someone to draw a picture for you. So it goes for the “free speech” that the SAE students used; that is present in us all and that we resent anyone telling us how to be sensitive toward racial prejudice after laws had to be passed to change the resultant hurt that has affected many minorities negatively. Now there is resentment toward “correct speech”.
Bulldog165 and those of you who have replied (agreeing or disagreeing) to him are all seeking honest discourse on the subject. Things are typed that are hurtful back and forth, but for all it’s scratchiness, this is a good thing that should go on in open forums in society. Sometimes these words appear callous and affect you enough to mentally wince and not want to read or hear them, but the source of the words all come from the American Spirit to purge them meaningfully from our society. We will never see the end in most of our lifetimes, but at least the conversation keeps us on the road to solve this knotty human problem that we all live with.
You are DGDs, one and all.
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“I have a dream that one day, down in Alabama, with its vicious racists, with its governor having his lips dripping with the words of ‘interposition’ and ‘nullification’ — one day right there in Alabama little black boys and black girls will be able to join hands with little white boys and white girls as sisters and brothers.”
And I have a dream that one day, down in Get the Picture land, with its viscous commenters, their stooped and worn keyboard fingers dripping with a thick, sticky consistency of derp, troll, labor and management expertise and better playcalling, one day right here at Get the Picture, Cojones will update his movie reviews
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I would not like to trade places with any group. I guess my comment came across as whining about it being okay to insult my “tribe”. I withdraw any comment that could be interpreted as whining. I hate whining and think people should STFU and work harder. I understand that I occupy a privilaged position. But I also have worked very hard and nobody has given me anything in life. I will bring this up at the next meeting of straight WASP’s.(We meet every Thurs night to discuss how to run the world).
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The above comment was in response to the good Senator.
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Lotta SAE’s in that meeting? Sure there are.
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“But I also have worked very hard and nobody has given me anything in life. ” So your tribal membership is due to your hard work? 🙂
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Some people want to stand on third base and act like they just hit a triple.
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Cutting them down every step of the way sure helps out those who aren’t as fortunate, huh? 😉
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what’ve you got against third base?
Anti Semite!
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I’m glad the student athletes aren’t letting their activism and desire to use their visibility to promote change interfere with their spring break plans.
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Why the hate bros. I just meant that there is a double standard. It led to the goat f**k that was the Duke “rape” case. Now, those guys were born on third base and were elites. Still it was unfair what was done to them. That would never have happened if they weren’t rich white guys. By the way, I was not born on third base, more like in the batters box with an 0-2 count. I never lived in a house or drove a car that had AC until I was 22. For the record I think the SAE’s are douchebags who are getting what’s coming to them. Also I am not really a member of a secret WASP club that runs the world.
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This. Because if there’s one thing proven this country won’t tolerate, it’s railroading minority defendants.
Gurkha, I understand where you’re coming from here, but you might want to think about applying the First Rule of Holes.
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LOL, point taken Senator. I’m a little slow today. When I read “First Rule of Holes” I thought you meant ” Opinions are like assholes, everbody has one and they all stink”. Then I thought, that makes no sense so I googled it. OK, I will stop digging, but don’t you think it proves my point a little that people have such a strong reaction just because I identified myself as a WASP. I really can’t do anything about being white anglo-saxon or heterosexual.
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“Also I am not really a member of a secret WASP club that runs the world.”
The WASPs in the Klan and some of the neo-Nazi right wing seem to have a different opinion about who runs the world, Gukha. 🙂
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*Gurkha…sorry
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Not sure what you mean Scorp.
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That, depending on who you listen to, there are differing opinions about who “runs the world” which I took as humor anyway.
It is amazing that folks of such widely-different world views can unite behind a college football team, ain’t it? 🙂
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True dat. You’re all DGD’s IMHO
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Senator, I’m glad you mentioned the first amendment issue because that seems to have been totally missed by OU, Boren, Stoops and the football team. In the US people, even assholes, are supposed to have rights. I agree that when you say/do something incredibly stupid like this there should be consequences. But I am certain that the University of Oklahoma has a student code of conduct and a student judicial system for dealing with student infractions written into its by-laws. All that was completely by-passed when its President summarily expelled 2 students who were determined to be the leaders of the SAE chant. While a student at Georgia I used to defend students in the student court. I say to all of you here that these kids are supposed to have rights, too. OU is a state university. Not wanting to get too legalistic, but it is a serious point to make, that the President of that august institution is acting with the force of state government behind him and that should be sufficient to trigger “state action connection” to what he did in expelling these kids without even a semblance of due process. I’m worried that in the race for everybody to outdo each other in their expressions of contempt for the actions of the SAEs involved, the larger issues of freedom of expression and due process have been lost. In the US peaceful KKK rallies where bigots spew their hateful rhetoric, Neo-Nazi marches (again as long as done peacefully), non-violent skin-head get-togethers and demonstrations of all kinds are all protected by the Constitution. What bothers me the most right now is that nobody from the ACLU or a similar organization has stepped up to say “enough.” I am also concerned about innocent students who happen to be members of the same fraternity are being punished when they didn’t have anything to do with the activities that caused the outrage. The reaction is starting to take on the appearance of a mob mentality which may actually be worse than the disease it allegedly seeks to cure. Rant concluded.
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Mayor, I believe the students who were expelled were not expelled for their speech, but for creating a hostile environment, not for first amendment violations…but maybe I misread that.
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You miss the point. Whatever the administration wants to call it, and it is a free speech issue no matter what Boren says, the students who were summarily expelled had a right to a hearing in the student court, the right to counsel and the right to present a defense. All that got ignored in the rush to prove OU can be more anti-racist than anybody else. And, BTW, has anyone even bothered to look for the vandals who spray-painted the SAE house? That doesn’t count in Norman anymore, apparently. To me this looks a lot like the NCAA’s actions in the State Penn matter, totally by-passing due process in order to pander to the media to make yourself look as good as possible. Boren’s self-serving actions are almost as disgusting as what the expelled students did.
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Agreed Mayor.
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Mayor, you do realize that “speech” on a college campus has been adjudged to be different from “speech” on the street?
I don’t miss your point, I just don’t agree with it.
But I will defend your right to make your point at least till spring practice starts.
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I don’t agree. Speech is speech, where ever and when ever. But similarly I will agree to vigorously defend your right to disagree with me–all the way until the season starts. 🙂
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