Hmmm… wonder if Nebraska Regent Hal Daub had as much of a problem with Lawrence Phillips suiting up as he has with the three Nebraska players who dared exercise their freedom of speech.
Filed under Political Wankery
If people in authority does not handle this kind of protest as during the Vietnam era, look out.
Er, wut? Are you suggesting they shoot a few peaceful protesters?
Don’t ask, Senator. Just get off his lawn.
Tin soldiers and Hal Daub’s coming.
Shades of Kent State. What do you do with a society when peaceful protesters are shot (one victim being an Eagle Scout who was trying to quell the campus “uprising”) and it never publicly decries or repudiates the action taken by a government of the people that doesn’t ask citizens if they want to repress individual expressions of freedom?
“Regent Hal Daub of Omaha, who served two years in Korea during the Vietnam War-era,”
Missed it by that much…
These guys especially at public universities definitely have the right to do this. If I were on the team, I wouldn’t be happy about it because it does seem that they are drawing attention to themselves by separating from the team. If I were the coach, that would be my message to them. If they want to attend a rally on their own time, speak at that rally, and get interviewed by the media, fine, but don’t take away from the team.
Regarding Lawrence Phillips, Tom Osborne should have never let him on the field.
Well alrighty then Trent Dilfer …
My point is that’s the conversation with the coaches that should have happened behind closed doors. If they wanted to do it at that point, fine but give them counsel on the impact on their teammates and coaches.
The “yeah I feel you, but could you do it some other way” argument is the height of chicken shittery. If the player wore a decal on his shoes or wore a shirt during warmups no one cares and no one talks about the issues that need to be discussed. That’s the point of the protest. It’s peaceful while at once public.
I don’t think the coaches talking to the players about the impact on the team is the height of “chicken s—.” I respect their right to protest and respect their right to do it in the way they see fit.
If these guys were real teammates, everyone on the team would understand the problems that black men face on the streets everyday, and they’d fall in line right behind them because that would be a powerful statement to see Eason, Douglas, et al standing (kneeling) in solidarity with their teammates who felt a need or desire to take a knee during the anthem.
If anyone DOESN’T think there’s a major problem with the new police state that feels the need to be judge, jury, and executioner, they’re the ones who are oblivious to the freedoms of our country, which include not being shot in the street by someone who’s, in theory, out there to protect us from the bad guys with guns.
Parrish and Ben got it right. None of this skirting around to the back door for a position on expression of dissent.
This is a social stand by football players that all of us should take. It’s that important for our thinking process as to what individual freedom really encompasses. What is it about their honorable and respectful method that pisses people off?
And coaches by their very nature are control freaks, who don’t want kids to take certain classes because it might distract them from their football.
And what exactly is the impact? What team has been harmed by these protests? Did it cause a turnover or a missed tackle? Was an OL so offended by Kapernick’s protest that he blew and assignment in a pre-season game and the QB was sacked?
For me one of the reasons that I support their right to protest is that it is a direct response to critics who have claimed that these athlete role models are not doing enough to speak out about issues. They are engaging in a non-violent social protest that hasn’t cause looting, or closing of roads. It requires no police protection. It doesn’t even try to confront an opposing side.
Yet, a whole bunch of mostly older white guys have been upset about it and are really quick to be dismissive of the right to protest, their voice to protest, their standing to protest, what they are protesting, how their protesting, and when they are protesting. Look at the faces of most of the people that have been protesting and then look at who has been most upset about it. It is pretty revealing.
So long as the speech doesn’t “trigger” anything the colleges are against, they are all for free speech.
Exactly. My guess is if these guys were Tebowing during the national anthem, you wouldn’t hear a peep out of Daub.
Actually, the NCAA might step in and put a stop to it.
Has the NCAA banned the gesture?
They banned black eye messages so lets not pretend colleges are a bastion of free speech.
Who’s pretending? I agree with you that it’s all about whose ox is being gored.
True that! I don’t believe either side these days values the constitution as we once did.
A hundred bucks says we would.
Also, the Phillips article shows that light punishments to ‘not mess up their life’ ain’t reserved just for rich white boys.
Gee, that must be why I see officials go out on the field after a football game and break up the kids praying as a group.
LMAO about your Phillips insight. Did you just now realize that schools with big football programs make an effort to protect their key players when they stray? Maybe you should start reading my posts about Huntley Johnson. Or Baylor.
Gee, I didn’t realize the prayer’s were doing thier thing during the National Anthem.
And the comment about Phillips was primarily facetious, I’m well aware what coaches will do to win. Maybe I will read your posts about Huntley Johnson.
So as long as the players don’t make a statement during the anthem, you’re cool with it?
I’d say that’s accurate.
At least you’re consistent and I give you credit for that. But I’ll bet most people who object to this are doing so because of the message more than the medium.
I would take that bet. I think you are highly underestimating the number of people who will die for a flag. A significant about of people don’t even know what they are protesting.
Right, as long as you make the people protesting die for their flag that you believe is different from your flag and love of country.
There are many people who have faced the ultimate expression of love of flag and country; that would be the expression of getting shot at and risking your precious life to a chance that a bullet won’t take you from this earth in a moment. I know many who have been in that situation and who applaud these peaceful expressions of protest above the protesters getting harmed because of what that flag stands for.
I heard these same expressions of negative patriotic reasoning in the 50s and 60s when Freedom Marchers changed many minds collectively. It all falls into the same ball of wax.
This is in response to Cojones. We have reached maximum comment depth so I had to reply to myself.
I’m not sure that you understood what I meant. I was saying that a lot of the people who are complaining about the people protesting during the National Anthem have no idea what the protesters are protesting. That is, my point was that most of the objection is based on patriotism and not an opposition to the BLM protesters for BLM sake.
I equate their protest with their of “Black Lives Matter” feelings of patriotism because they are using that vehicle publicly to enforce the association. It’s the perfect peaceful public protest by the perfect public figures.
And I read most of the posts about Baylor. I just don’t see a whole lot of the same rage in the main stream as is being displayed over the Stanford swimmer.
Oy. Whatever, man. There’s so much mainstream rage you can’t even remember the kid’s name.
Did you not see it?
Deadspin’s Diana Moskovitz has been doing the Lord’s work with her coverage of the chicken shit way Baylor has handled everything. There were multiple <a href = “http://www.espn.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/14675790/baylor-officials-accused-failing-investigate-sexual-assaults-fully-adequately-providing-support-alleged-victims>segments on OTL including the victims at Baylor sharing their experiences and how Baylor failed them. There was a blog post from a Baylor victim that circulated social media a few months ago pretty widely. I’d argue Baylor has put more effort into damage control as an institution because they have the resources to do such, but there’s no lack of reporting or outrage out there.
What I find very interesting about this is that when football players do this at a PUBLIC university its their First amendment rights. When a Christian speaks at a public university emphasis on PUBLIC, they have to go through reams of paperwork to exercise their First Amendment rights at a PUBLIC university or they are shut down altogether. The hypocrisy.
The Regent is right, they don’t have to accept a scholarship or play football. I DO NOT agree or believe the BLM group is real. It is funded by George Soros as a chaos group designed to buttress his candidate. A year from now they won’t exist. The false narrative against the Law enforcement is just that.
If they are really concerned then go to Chicago where black folks are killing black folks, but that doesn’t matter because it doesn’t fit the narrative.
So you’re telling me that a uga student can’t give witness to another without penalty? You sure about that?
Can a student wear a cross? A shirt with a Christian message?
How many religious based institutions do I walk past on lumpkin street that are associated with uga?
I know that there is a victimization fetish out there but let’s be serious.
A football player can’t use eye black for a message.
You do understand that such is a neutral restriction right? It doesn’t say you can put anything except religious text there. Our guys put “we run this state” on the eye black. That might be considered by some as taunting. If you want to convince me that someone was after Tebow you have to explain to me why Tebow could stop a game for five minutes while he jumped up and down over a 1 yard gain while AJ got a celebration flag for glancing at the crowd after a potentially game winning catch.
Sure. Its neutral since it happened after Tebow got so much press about how he was doing it. Neither side these days is about free speech.
Neither side has ever been about free speech. Ideologues hate free speech. Free speech is hard. You have to support it for speech you vehemently disagree with. That’s hard for a lot of simple minded people. If you say you want Nazis to have the freedom to speak, then you’re accused of being pro-Nazi.
If you respect the establishment clause and suggest that it might not be a good idea to have teacher led public school prayer then you’re an atheist communist.
The first amendment is the most important and most misunderstood amendment.
Except the government is in the business of firing people for their “free speech” these days, especially if it is religious in nature (see the Atlanta fire chief Mr. Cochran). The Atlanta fire chief got fired for what he wrote in a book. But Lewis L. and the IRS can go after conservatives and still draw a pay check.
Oh, FFS. If the Atlanta Fire Chief came out and equated Christianity to pederasty and bestiality, would you think that would not diminish their ability to lead a large and diverse public service organization? It is awful hard to lead people when you publicly let them know that, according to your religious beliefs, the proper recourse if for them to be stoned to death.
Btw do you protest this? https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/video/2015/nov/24/chicago-officials-release-video-showing-police-killing-of-laquan-mcdonald-video
Where were all the protests over this? http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/06/us/chicago-tyshawn-lee-shooting/index.html
I’m tracking on that but I didn’t see any of them hit the football field.
So you think gangs respond to protesters? Shit dude the get on your anti-Black Ganster Disciple clothing and your anti-Latin Kings signs and go to Chicago! After all as you deftly noted a criminal street gang is every bit as worried about electoral politics as the mayor right? I think you’re on to something here. Go for it.
I’ll take a knee for your soul during the anthem. Promise.
If it hasn’t occurred to you yet, I think this is among the dumber arguments ever. Police abuse can be addressed through politics. Criminality can’t be directly addressed effectively by protest. The suggestion is that the black community is indifferent to the murders of their fellow citizens by criminals. That is both stupid and offensive.
Nearly as offensive and ignorant is the suggestion that roughly 93 percent of African-Americans consistently vote for the democratic presidential nominee because they are too dumb to know any better.
Put away your Jump to Conclusions Mat Derek. I did not state nor imply any of what you threw out there.
But don’t you think that if situations like that garnered the same national attention that (a select few) of the police shootings do, that some sort of positive outcome could result?
Not really no. Nothing gets more news than the missing/murdered pretty white lady/child. Can’t say that there is a media coverage/frequency correlation there.
I don’t think we can “outrage” ourselves out of senseless violence. If it were up to me we’d end the drug war and simultaneously insist that every person from about 14 to 24 was either:
Working full time
In the military
Or, if necessary, incarcerated.
No reason we should let people of that age sit around not doing a damn thing but looking for trouble.
At least your brand of authoritarianism is more utilitarian. I suppose that’s an improvement.
This is the oath of allegiance to become an American citizen:
“I hereby declare, on oath, that I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state, or sovereignty of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen; that I will support and defend the Constitution and laws of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I will bear arms on behalf of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform noncombatant service in the Armed Forces of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform work of national importance under civilian direction when required by the law; and that I take this obligation freely without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; so help me God.”
You can call my plan whatever you want but it’s entirely consistent with this oath.
Oliver’s Army is on their way,
Oliver’s Army is here to stay…
” When a Christian speaks at a public university emphasis on PUBLIC, they have to go through reams of paperwork to exercise their First Amendment rights at a PUBLIC university or they are shut down altogether. The hypocrisy.”
Dude, I was at the UGA/UNC game this season and there was a pregame Christian-and-Christian-only prayer over the Dome PA system. Quit with this stuff.
It was not an event sanctioned by one of the universities. That would have been out of bounds. That was the Atlanta Sports Council and CFA’s party and we were invited to it. If you have a problem with it, go to the city of Atlanta and tell them to stop the game, or go to the AD and tell him never to schedule that game again.
Very different than a prayer/invocation before a game at your local public high school or in Sanford.
You go to a game at a private school they usually have a prayer before the game whether they play a public or private school.
“It is funded by George Soros as a chaos group designed to buttress his candidate.”
Excellent detective work. The best.
Based on their age you never know if they are racists, or just too dumb to understand but coaches and administrators need to get a grasp on this. There is a place for peaceful protests but the sideline of a football stadium is absolutely not the place. Fans don’t pay the cost of attending games to get slapped in their faces by athletes who don’t seem to understand what the event is about. Keep them in the locker room during the anthem, or send them back to turn in their equipment.
Fans don’t pay the cost of attending games to get slapped in their faces by athletes who don’t seem to understand what the event is about.
Does that cover any form of self-expression, Mac? If atheists would be offended by Tebow’s gesturing, is that enough for you to say he should keep his religious feelings to himself? If so, I give you credit for intellectual consistency. If not, you’d make a good Nebraska regent. 🙂
And probably a good Georgia Regent. 🙂
I think the athletes understand perfectly well “what the event is about.” Perhaps it’s the fans misunderstanding. What’s up with this compulsory standing up and saluting stuff?
Take the pledge to the flag. If we saw a video of a classroom of Chinese children standing up each morning and putting their hands over their heart and singing a little song in honor of some object, we’d look and say “Man, that’s kinda creepy. They brainwash them early over there, don’t they?”
Maybe the solution is getting rid of the national anthem and just playing ball. THAT’S what the event is all about. You want to dress up like Uncle Sam and goose-step to show your patriotism, fine. Do it at home.
Why should the person in uncle Sam garb have to goose step at home while the spoiled college children show disrespect on national TV? The spoiled have no more rights than any other. By the way a classroom of children saying the pledge, of any nation, is a good thing.
Funny as hell and it won’t be appreciated by some here who will view that as sacrilege since their patriotic expressions approach religious fervor.
Wait a minute! Isn’t that why many people are killing each other at this moment?
As I said…. pure chicken shittery.
Maybe colleges could mark off some kind of “free speech zone” outside the stadium for athletes to exercise their rights.
Does it really affect you in some visceral way for someone to kneel during the national anthem? When the anthem is played, I look at the flag. I don’t look at what the players are doing during the anthem, nor do I necessarily care. I feel like this is a much better way to protest than to interrupt the game in some way or march down the interstate during rush hour. Does it rub us the wrong way because it doesn’t follow the societal norms, or that they are protesting at all? When you start talking about what the players receive (scholarship, education, etc.), then it starts to sound like they should just shut up and be grateful that the Man decided to give them anything at all… which is part of why they are protesting. If it’s the former, then that is what a protest is supposed to do: make us feel a little uncomfortable and draw our attention to an issue. We need to get over being offended so easily.
Old white guys telling young people of color what they can protest, how they can protest and when they can protest. The more things change the more they stay the same.
The demographics of pro and college football teams has many old white guys with “skin in the game” shutting the fuck up so that’s a new twist.
Really? The oppressed old white guy who cannot say anything has been totally eradicated from the world of football. Let me get my crying towel.
No, but they say their racist shit behind closed doors and hope like hell they aren’t being taped.
I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro’s great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen’s Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to “order” than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: “I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action”; who paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man’s freedom; who lives by a mythical concept of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait for a “more convenient season.” Shallow understanding from people of good will is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection.
Just read Dr. King’s letter from a Birmingham Jail on that subject and it wasn’t white moderates preaching patience that MLK was fighting either.
That is Dr. King’s Letter from a Birmingham Jail.
He considered the white moderates who in theory may have agreed with equal rights but valued “law & order” over progress to be the most difficult challenge to the cause.
That is why the professor at Clemson was so upset with Dabo’s comments where he invoked the words of Dr. King without truly grasping the meaning of them.
What does the flag symbolize? The illusion of a perfect society? Complete political conformity? A society that bullies people into making their protests in the least visible way possible? Funny, I grew up thinking that was the Hammer and Sickle.
Watch the video of the young man talking about the death threats he and his teammates received. What bothers you more – some black players kneeling during a national anthem or some white people shouting on social media that said players should be shot or hung?
This country is better off today for all the people who ever stood up and said, “We can do better. We should do better. We will do better.” That’s what democracies are, and that’s where democracies draw their strength. Not conformity or public rituals. That’s more a China/Soviet Union thing.
The entire statement the LB read was fantastic. Nebraska fans (I’m one of them) should be proud of the kid. I’m not surprised people are mad, but those people don’t understand (or refuse to try and understand) why the protests are happening.
It’s not an anti-military protest. No one is bashing soldiers. It’s symbolic. The flag stands for things way beyond the men and women who serve. It stands for all that’s good and all that COULD BE better. Right now race relations between police and minority communities could be a lot better. Protesting silently in hopes to advance that relationship forward is a great thing.
I think that this makes it clear that police shooting people too quickly just isn’t a problem. Here’s a guy with an assault rifle, obviously drunk and belligerent, cursing at the cops and grabbing his crotch. They just talk him down and diffuse the situation. Isn’t this how it always works?
This is not a constitutional issue. This is a workplace issue. Therefore there is no right of freedom of speech. The university has every right to enforce a code of conduct. This type of dishonor should be put down and not allowed by the University. These spoiled college-age children can protest wherever they would like but not in the workplace. For the University to do nothing is a failure of authority. Shame on them all.
Except Nebraska (and every other university out there) insists these are not employees and these are not workplaces.
Beyond that, Nebraska is an arm of the state government. It is a constitutional issue.
Yep. And that makes a BIG difference. If Nebraska was not a state school, but a private one, they would be able to limit speech with little worry about the constitution.
College athletes aren’t employees.
They are when it’s convenient. 😉
Pretty funny how that works.
Here’s a story where no one died.
A 15 year old girl fell off a bike. When police tried to offer her medical assistance, she refused and said she just wanted to go home. So of course the police yanked her off the bike, cuffed her, shoved her into the back of a police car, and pepper sprayed her when she wouldn’t pull her legs into the back seat. All the while telling people video-taping the encounter that they were taking her to the hospital.
And they lied, because they took her to the police station, interrogated her, and then charged her with resisting arrest.
For falling off a bike.
Some audiences never see stories like this, week after week. And some audiences see them all the time.
That’s part of the problem here. I’m not saying that anyone has a responsibility to find stories like these, but I have zero issue with people trying to draw attention to patterns of institutional behavior like these.
Which is why I prefer “Law Enforcement Transparency Matters” to _____ Lives Matter.
What a blessed existence some people must have when the thing that angers them the most is a couple of students protesting during the national anthem.
I like Benjamin Watson’s take on this issue.
Mark Richt has lost control of GTP. Again!
Of course the players have the right to kneel during the anthem. It is precisely BECAUSE they have that right, that they should stand. Try doing that in a country that REALLY oppresses its people.
G-D I hate when GTP drifts into politics. Discussing UGA football is difficult enough but at least I know we all are united in our hatred of all things orange. Political discussions only demonstrate out how hopelessly divided this country has become. I implore the Senator to keep this Blog on point.
Here’s how this is supposed to work: I write about things that interest me and you read about things that interest you. Ideally, this should work out fine for both of us.
It’s a post about football, by the way. It happens that politics intrudes there like it does in so many other places we’d prefer that it not.
No disrepect intended and I was not suggesting you ever change the content! This is your blog and it is a great site because of you.
If there were zero comments I would still read it nearly every day. If it became a pay site I would gladly pay!
But you force us to read and comment on every post for the sole purpose of banning us because you love to trample our first amendment rights! You don’t fool me, Bluto!
Politics didnt intrude football here. One player’s desperation for attention that he once had, then lost, used a political issue to promote himself above all his peers. Politics was invited into football by an individual player.
One player’s desperation for attention that he once had, then lost, used a political issue to promote himself above all his peers.
I meant his need for attention led him to use a political issue to promote himself. (He probably sincerely believes the BS though.) Unfortunately, due to his actions, it has now spread throughout the NFL, college and high school ranks and probably lower and its a sad thing. Kids that don’t know any better now denouncing the whole country because of a false narrative that was concocted and perpetuated to drive voter turnout. By all measures, conditions within the African American community have only gotten worse under the first black president. The Democrat party has feared this would result in lower turnout among blacks, (who have overwhelmingly voted D for decades) so this whole thing was propped up. Other things to note: it wasnt even a police shooting that started BLM. And of the officer involved shootings, 99% of them wouldn’t have happened of the person would have just done what the officer said.
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