So, if it turns out that David Pollack is prescient and nails this…
… does that mean:
- Newman is a better QB than Fromm?
- Newman’s receivers were better than Fromm’s?
- Newman’s OC/position coach was better than Fromm’s?
You can only pick one. I would lean towards number three, myself.
Get The Picture 
Since we are assuming he goes first round, then #2 and #3 don’t matter because they draft on talent, arm strength and who has the physical attributes of an NFL qb. Thus I choose # 1
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Newman is a better QB (prospect) than Fromm.
Measurables matter.
Stafford was NOT a better qb at Georgia than David Greene. Stafford went first overall and made a career in the league because he has talents that Greene lacked.
Playing qb in the sec is not the same as playing the position on sundays. Draft positions will reflect that.
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If he had chosen to go in the 2020 draft, would Newman have been taken in the first round?
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Do the Packers still have a 1st round pick in this scenario?
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Tell me how he did at the combine first.
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Assume what you’ve seen on tape and in his stats extrapolates to that.
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Not possible. If it were about college stats and game film, there would be no combine.
Eason doesn’t go higher than Fromm based on film and stats. The measureables and the arm talent separated them….at the combine.
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You didn’t know Eason had a stronger arm than Fromm until the combine? Ho-kay, I think we’re done here.
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I guess subtleties such as the degree to which there was a gap in arm strength aren’t worth observing?
I guess all those scouts are wasting their time at the combine. I mean, fuck a stopwatch right?
I mean we already KNOW Randy Moss can run faster than most receivers. Why bother to put a number to it?
Imagine this NFL team conversation on draft day:
Should we take Moss or X?
Whose faster?
Moss.
By how much?
Shrugs shoulders.
The fact is that most people, including Mel Kiper who I heard with my own ears on espn, were surprised at the GAP between Eason’s and Herbert’s ball velocity and Fromm’s….at the combine.
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I remember Kiper saying that and I remember this article https://www.ourlads.com/story/default/Quarterback-Ball-Velocity-at-NFL-Combine-2008-2017/10243/dh/ Eason – Got it; Jake – Ok; and then Herbert — 2 mph is that noticable? 6 mph probably
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This says Herbert threw 60 mph:
Pretty impressive prospect.
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I only hear Rich Eisen say 60 mph with the quick graphic and other website searches show 54. Having said that, your point had me looking for more of a definition of a strong arm — and the results are what I would call scattered. E.g. subject to interpretation and it might not be conducive to empirical data. Strong arm = accuracy+excellent mechanics+velocity+?+?? So whether 60 or 54 is the right number, Herbert’s athleticism and velocity outweight Fromm’s.
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Probably not, but it’s not unreasonable to think he would have gone higher than Fromm, based purely on being a better prospect.
As best I can tell, you need to be elite or well above average in at least 2 of 3 Categories to be drafted fairly high:
Height
Speed/Mobility
Arm strength
Jake is average in 2 of the 3, and below average in the 3rd (speed/mobility). Newman checks the boxes higher in all 3 categories. I would be willing to bet money he would have gone higher than Jake in this year’s draft.
I also hope Jake makes all the doubters eat their words. Not saying I think he will, but I definitely hope he does.
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Not the question I’m asking.
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Not exactly, but the fact that he is a better prospect in the first place can’t be discounted in your question.
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I don’t know about first round, but it’s a safe bet he would have gone ahead of Fromm, since everyone else went ahead if Fromm.
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Agree…..got a feeling Jake is going to prove a lot of people wrong.
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There is a question of whether he’ll ever get a shot. The bills have a franchise qb. I imagine that if Fromm does great and he and Matt Barkley are seen as equal back ups, Barkley may have value as trade bait. That would at least get jake to back up status. Otherwise, Fromm is third team. Maybe. A former third round pick is the bills third team qb right now.
Fromm has a long way to go to seeing the field in a regular season game.
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I think he will get a shot, once they see what he can do when things are live. Don’t think he will be a starter this year unless there are injuries…..could be a lifetime backup. Not a bad gig to have.
FWIW, his struggle last year was mostly because of receivers. Injuries, youth, drops, wrong routes, depth, jammed at LOS and some just not developed yet.
Hard to score points when other teams load the box because they don’t respect the receivers….just pin your ears back & go.
As far as this year goes at UGA, I think the receiving group will be better. More depth, more experience, probably bigger and stronger so they can get off the LOS and etc.
I do think play calling and game planning did have something to do with it (production) whether it was Coley or Smart.
Don’t know for sure, but think Smart meddled. Hopes he stays out of it and let’s the OC do what he was hired for.
Nonetheless, I see Jake as a backup.
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How will it “prove a lot of people wrong” if he’s a backup?
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A backup is a pretty damn good job…..don’t you think??
A lot of folks thought he wasn’t even worthy of the pros. I wouldn’t be shocked to see him start later on…..he has beat out some good ones before.
If my memory serves me correct, he was projected as a first rounder a year ago. He hasn’t forgot how to play QB…….extenuating circumstances caused his drop off
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I thought we were talking about proving people wrong, not whether being an NFL QB is a good job.
He was drafted. If he’s a backup with a spot start here or there, that’s not proving anybody wrong. I’m not saying it’s a bad career, so don’t try again to frame it that way.
And if he was projected as a first rounder a year ago, being a backup is falling short of first round expectations. You shouldn’t have brought that up as it weakens your argument.
Take off the homer glasses.
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Reading and comprehension issues?
“A lot of folks thought he wasn’t even worthy of the pros” (proving people wrong)
I also mentioned there were extenuating circumstances for his last season in his performance. Hence, he has performed before…reason to believe he will again.
Nobody knows if he will perform, but my guess is …..he will. Football is played from the neck up at that position (first-most important).
If you want to argue, at least read it & quit coming off as some half-cocked yahoo.
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LOL, you already posted this way down below. You couldn’t even do that correctly and you’re calling someone else a yahoo and trying to make fun of their intelligence.
You’re all over the place. In one breath, you were talking about your fluff claim that a lot of people supposedly thought he shouldn’t be on an NFL team (nevermind that this is just typical “but I’ve seen lots of posts saying that” bs whining). In your next breath, you were talking about how he was projected as a first rounder before this year. Yet that somehow means (in your mind) that if he’s a backup, he’s proving a lot of people wrong. I guess you’re refering to all those posts you’ve supposedly seen saying that he shouldn’t be on an NFL team and not the actual first round projections given to him prior to this year (or the fact that he was, you know, drafted this year).
I’ll say it again. Take off the homer glasses and get a grip.
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I guess you will surmise what you want…..DA gonna DA.
“Hard to explain barometric pressure to a dumb ass”.
Not sure why it is so important for you to change my view.
Run all along, you are too challenged….bless you!
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It’s going to be hard for you to explain much of anything to anyone, let alone barometric pressure. I wouldn’t try.
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Beyond Fields and Trevor Lawrence, the competing talent in the 2021 QB class drops off considerably.
Wait…I forgot about Kyle Trask.
Nevermind.
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Arm strength is the biggest discrepancy between the 2. The NFL thinks they can teach Jake’s strongest attribute – mental processing. The NFL knows by age 21 arm strength isn’t changing much.
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True. But for the 2020 class, can the NFL teach it in half the time?
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So I’m hopeful he does well and he’s obviously got the physical tools but I don’t know why Newman is getting all this hype. How do we know he’s not Grayson Lambert 2.0?
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I think 2018 Fromm was pretty damn good, 2019 Fromm sucked. I attribute that to coaching.
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Did the NFL not get his 2018 film?
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Depending upon the team scheme may suit which qb is better….talking NFL qb’s, that place is littered with individuals who were world beaters at the college level, drafted and gone after the initial contract expired, NFL gm’s for better or worse will draft “Johnny football” over relatively known, safer individual with a far greater upside…..hindsight as with injuries and schemes ya just never know….
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I choose 4…. None of the above! Jake’s knowledge of the game, which makes him an excellent college quarterback, can’t overcome his lack of physical attributes. The raw athletic ability of NFL players is insane. All the coaching in the world can’t overcome that.
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Given I’m not an NFL fan, the only thing I care about is whether Monken and Newman improve on the 12-2 performance of last year. That’s the measuring stick for Jamie Newman. Beat all of our rivals (Jake Fromm has a spot in the WLOCP HoF waiting on him as a 3-0 starting QB). Get to Atlanta. Hopefully, win that game. Whether Newman goes in the 1st round or is undrafted matters not to me.
I imagine Jake is in Warner Robins right now thinking, “I could have been the BMOC for one more year rather than wondering if I’m going to have a job next year.” I can’t imagine a worse situation for Jake to go to than a small market city in a foul weather climate like Buffalo with a young starter in front of him.
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Yes..
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What was great was Pollack shutting down Herbstriet (live) after his glowing of Lawrence & especially TOSU Fields. Watching it live made me proud of Pollack stepping on the toes of Herbstreit — and the rolling of the eyes by Herbie & Desmond was priceless.
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My only question is whether Isaiah Wilson’s mom is the greatest mom in the history of the draft.
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I think Newman has about a 50% chance of being a first round pick. He has the arm and mobility that NFL teams want, he seems smart, and he has a very talented team around him that will help make him look good.
I’m not really interested in biting on the better than Fromm part though. Fromm was key to the best 2 years of UGA football since Herschel and I don’t need NFL success to validate his worth. He’s a DGD.
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Third-day draftees and undrafted free agents from the 2020 class are at a disadvantage as shortened training camps and (likely) fewer preseason games will limit their opportunity to secure a roster spot.
This was an unanticipated factor when underclassmen made their decision. For many, making the practice squad will be reasonable goal to open a better opportunity in 2021. Perseverance will be tested.
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My first reaction is to object that your assuming facts not in evidence…..that fact being that Newman will be a first round pick. Pollack is just wrong on that point so the question itself is bogus. Every time I see these pro metrics I ,being old, think of the Falcons and Andre Bruce….(i have no idea if that is how you spell his name and don’t want to bother to look it up)…. but that guy checked every box physically and it really did not matter.( also see Jamarcus Russell…the list goes on) There is a big difference between being a physical specimen and being a football player. Newman will benefit from having better receivers but I doubt it will make him elite unless he develops some sort of Jedi/Vulcan mind meld thing with Pickens and then ignore everything I just said. I truly do not expect Newman to pull a Joe Burrows because of lack of time and the defenses will be catching up.I expect much better and more runs in the RPO but an increase in interceptions, You pay your money and you take your chances. #2 under protest.
.
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“If” is literally the second word in the post.
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Hypothetical questions, how do they work?
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
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Look Wilbur, we ain’t experts so hypothetical questions are still the equivalent of asking the ignition timing of a 55 Bel-Air with a 327 and a 4 barrel carburetor.” It a bullshit question”……Is that hypothetical enough for ya?
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#3 is the right answer. Even in the NFL, job one is to get your QB into rhythm. Coley/Moore’s slow-paced offense rarely met that necessity. Occasionally they would go up-tempo and put the game in Fromm’s hands. Like magic his footwork and accuracy improved and the receivers got open. After moving the ball and putting up points, the coaches would return to playing defensively … “like we didn’t have the superior athletes.” (Saban quote) So it’s #3. Coaching malpractice killed a great quarterback.
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Fromm’s feet didnt magically get better, they stunk the whole time. Furthermore, at a high level as a junior they shouldn’t need a magic switch coaxed out
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So, his apparent success in 2017 and 2018 were in spite of his feet. The only way to make up for an average arm is to have good mechanics. Everyone knew Fromm didn’t have the arm that Eason (or Fields) was blessed with. He made up for it with his mental edge and his fundamentals. His fundamentals suffered under Coley when Coley was also forced to build game plans every week. This isn’t hard to understand.
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I looked forward to the revisionist history after the draft. His feet were terrible the whole time. His legs are below average. In 2017 he had the best running back tandem in history. Remember Cooley was his quarterback coach the year before and it wasn’t cooley that made him stand like a statue and miss open receivers.
If you take your Homer glasses off from just wasn’t all that The NFL seems to agree and his career is essentially over now. Without height and an arm, this whole “mental” thing paraded goes out the window.
I was a MAJOR early on Coley hater and just about despised Kirby for his staff decisions before the year even started. But like I said, I looked forward to the revisionist history of red glass wearing Fromm fans.
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His performance in every statistical area was better in 18 than in 17 without those running backs with him. I don’t care about the NFL, so I have no homer glasses on about what happened over the last 3 days.
If he was so terrible, why couldn’t two 5 star QBs (one who was already the starter) with superior physical tools beat him out?
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Justin Fields would have likely won a Heisman last year if not for a history making season by Burrow. We needed him bad last year and he’d slay this year
The answer is because kirby is a terrible QB manager, evaluator, coach, planner.
Eason basically only played 2 years, had horrible coaching, was on a bad team, did bad interviews and still drafted higher. Fields will likely be QB 1 or 2.
Were were all the folks a week ago saying Coley was about to ruin Fromms draft? That’s right. Homer bias.
As far as I’m concerned kirby needs to be very far away from the QB room. It’s a major weakness, a terrible mismanagement, gave horrible offensive gameplan. And I’m big on kirby in every other arena.
Good day. Out
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Kirby’s a genius in every other phase of the game but has no idea about QBs. I guess the fact that Elite 11 QBs keep lining up to play for him seems to indicate the exact opposite.
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Who is Moore?
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Number one by a landslide.
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LOL. “You can only pick one.”
Nuance, meet my narrative.
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I’m sorry, Bill. Didn’t realize you get to set the rules here.
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I’m still trying to recover from the fact that Fromm forwent his senior season for a contract that will probably fast track him to the XFL. He can probably make better money after taxes and agent fees if he sells insurance for State Farm instead of endorsements. What a waste.
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Fromm definitely has his limitations as a QB but the QB coaching was bad last season. Jim Chaney and Jay Johnson had been handling most of that responsibility previously. Unfortunately, they weren’t around anymore and there wasn’t the necessary expertise on staff to pick up where they left off. That led to Fromm’s struggles as much as anything.
At least Kirby recognized his mistake of not appropriately replacing those 2 coaches last offseason and has tried to correct it with the hires of Monken and Faulkner.
That bungle combined with letting the best QB talent on the roster get away pretty much wrote the script for the 2019 season.
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#4 David Pollack is a vanilla cfb tv analyst.
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Lol.
And people call me a troll!
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It’s not #1. Newman is probably not a better college QB than Fromm, but he has a better arm and more mobility. And the nfl draft is all about making projections.
It’s not #2. Newman has Pickens. Not sure who the other WRs will be. We can assume McKitty will be TE. I think we had a better idea who Fromm’s WRs and TEs would be going into 2019. The problem was, Simmons, DRob and Landers ended up being far less dependable than we’d anticipated, and Cager and Jackson had injuries. DRob and Landers improving for 2020 is far from certain. Jackson and Blaylock have problems too. Aside from Pickens, 2020 WRs are a mystery.
It’s not #3. That’s essentially saying Newman is more coach-able than Fromm. Fromm had the benefit of Cheney, Johnson, and Coley over 3 years. The constant here is the HC – who demands a very conservative offense. I think we’re going to be disappointed if we think Monken is going to be allowed to change the O drastically. Kirby turning an OC and QB loose to rack up big offensive numbers would foresage a new utopian world. Monken and Newman putting up Tua or Mayfield numbers ain’t gonna happen.
Newman “could be” a 1st rounder. It appears he has the arm and mobility the nfl looks for these days. Not sure he can be a better college QB than Fromm. That will be challenging in Kirby’s offense.
So I won’t pick any of the 3 options.
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I’m actually somewhat optimistic that Kirby is trying to get over his lust for manball. I base that not only on the Monken hire but also on the Luke hire. Luke prefers his offensive linemen to be a little bit lighter and more agile.
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Of course, I thought Kirby would start changing the offensive approach 2 years ago to better fit Mr. Fields. So, I may not be the best predictor of what he’s thinking.
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“I handed the all off a lot.” “I didn’t do shit.”
Yeah. I’ll take their suggestions on it vice the opinion of an 18 year old.
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You should take your doctor’s suggestions on your medication vice your opinion.
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Half of Fromm’s starting offense was drafted to play football in the NFL.
If Pickens was eligible, he would have been taken too. Mays will line drafted as well.
If Jake Fromm has played at Arkansas or Ole Miss, he makes maybe a 1 or 2 win difference over the course of 3 years and nobody watching the television games is saying “Man, I hope the Falcons draft that kid from Arkansas”.
Fromm was the product of the talent and coaching around him, not limited by it.
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Well…..I think they had the troll part right.
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Yeah,
I say things radical like…..everything the pros scouts saw.
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What if its all three?
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Someone asked …”Who’s Moore” The answer …. Kirby Moore UGA quarterback 1965-1967. I’m pretty dang proud of this little miscue. After all, how many people remember players on a team playing 55 years ago?
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Reading and comprehension issues?
“A lot of folks thought he wasn’t even worthy of the pros” (proving people wrong)
I also mentioned there were extenuating circumstances for his last season in his performance. Hence, he has performed before…reason to believe he will again.
Nobody knows if he will perform, but my guess is …..he will. Football is played from the neck up at that position (first-most important).
If you want to argue, at least read it & quit coming off as some half-cocked yahoo.
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LOL, you couldn’t even post your reply in the right place and you’re calling someone else a yahoo and trying to make fun of their intelligence.
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I feel bad for Jake, but he really misjudged the situation when he declared. You are whatever you did last, in almost every business. Jake should have looked at his body of work from 2019 and realized that everyone was going to claim one of 2 things about him; 1) he was a system QB or 2) he benefited from the wealth of riches around him (or, I guess, a combination of 1 & 2). If he really felt strongly about the NFL, his call should have been to come back and prove his talent next year. You can’t have film missing throws all over the field and losing big games be your highlights when you already know you aren’t going to get a pass because of the measurables.
Honestly whoever was advising him did a terrible job. It’s business 101 to leave on a high note.
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#3
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Thought about this all day for some reason. Changing my answer to #1 instead of #3.
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Pollack is regurgitating a months old opinion on Newman as a first rounder.
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