April 16, 2020 · 12:25 PM

Not out of the woods yet

Damn it, this was not the answer I wanted to hear, Kirbs.

How different Todd Monken’s new offense will look…

“I think the biggest thing when you look for the difference is going to be who the playmakers are. Last year D’Andre Swift was a feature presentation. Cager early in the season was that. Who are those guys going to be because every offense is built around who are those guys we have to get the ball too. With Zamir (White), James Cook, some tight ends we think are going to be good players. We’ll have some really good players. George is going to be good. We have some wideouts that we got to have got involved to be as successful as we want to be. So how successful will we be? That will be based on who those playmakers are. I just hope we get a chance to find that out.”

“Players, not plays” was Coley’s mantra.  I was kinda hoping we were moving past that.

Please let this be misdirection.

15 Comments

Filed under Georgia Football, Strategery And Mechanics

15 responses to “Not out of the woods yet”

  1. W Cobb Dawg
    April 16, 2020 at 12:59 PM

    I doubt Monken agreed to take the job so he could be the next Coley or so he could run the ball up the middle ad nauseum. One would think LSU’s offense seared in a lesson Kirby will never forget.

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  2. Derek
    April 16, 2020 at 1:01 PM

    Why would you make the effort to get the ball into the hands of your lesser players?

    Beautifully drawn incompletions seem to me to be of little value.

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    • Senator Blutarsky
      April 16, 2020 at 1:04 PM

      I keep forgetting you’re a strategical genius. Apologies for that.

      Georgia’s roster is stocked with four- and five-star talent. I’m not worried about whose hands the ball winds up in nearly as much as I am knowing somebody’s figured out a way to make sure those hands are free in the first place.

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      • Derek
        April 16, 2020 at 1:41 PM

        Then where’s the conflict? You don’t think the coaches can do both?

        Why can’t you decide who needs to get the ball AND figure out how best to get it to those guys?

        Do you fear that they decide to throw 9 routes to Zeus and dive plays with Pickens because they only got around to deciding who the best players are?

        Every million dollar DC we’ll face knows exactly how to deploy their guys to counter any “schematic advantage” the offense may think they have. Kirby knows that well.

        What no DC can do? Make their corner a better player than Pickens. Kirby well knows that too.

        That’s why its all about recruiting i.e., its about the Jimmies and Joes.

        When Bobo faked it to Gurley and ran a p/a roll out throw to the TE with Hutson, that was as a “plays over players” move you could make. How’d it work out for us?

        Of course you need to catch the defense in a bind now and then, but over the course of the season both you and the defense need to know who you are and say: you have no chance to stop what you already know is coming.

        If it was about X’s and O’s there would be more than 5-7 programs with a chance to with a natty in 2020.

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        • Senator Blutarsky
          April 16, 2020 at 1:44 PM

          Then where’s the conflict? You don’t think the coaches can do both?

          Coley couldn’t, at least not on a consistent basis.

          If you watched any of the clips I posted about the offenses Monken’s run at his various stops, he’s good at scheming to get players open. Hopefully the players can take it from there. That’s all I’m asking for.

          Liked by 1 person

          • Rocketdawg
            April 16, 2020 at 2:56 PM

            The more I rewatch games from the last 3 years and really break them down like I’m watching film vs watching as a fan the more convinced I am that Coley was a horrible, horrible coach. The regression for Fromm from 2018 to 2019 is remarkable. The difference in Jake’s footwork from 2018 to 2019 is noticeable to even the most untrained eye. His release point on a lot of throws were way off as well. This whole “Fromm has a weak arm” narrative is primarily from poor mechanics. While he doesn’t have an Eason arm, his throws in 2018 had more zip on them than 2019. I think we also sold Cheney short on what he brought to the table in play design and scheming players open. The difference in receivers running wide open in ‘18 vs Fromm having to throw into tight windows in ‘19 is amazing.

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            • Derek
              April 16, 2020 at 3:47 PM

              I was also underwhelmed at Fromm’s play action. He didn’t consistently stick it in the RB’s “bread basket” and sell it like other QB’s we have.

              It seems to me that if you’re designing everything around play action, that’s something that needs to be cleaned up.

              This is an area, like many, where competition is crucial. And we didn’t have any of it last year at QB. If you have two guys that are close they will focus on the details, or not play.

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          • dawgtired
            April 16, 2020 at 3:01 PM

            “Coley couldn’t…”

            We either have to admit Coley couldn’t call successful plays consistently or we have to conclude we didn’t have the talent we thought we had. I guess one more option is that we didn’t have the field-level coaching to coach the players to their potential.

            I think we had the talent. So, apparently we didn’t know how to exploit it.

            Kirby’s answer is two-fold.
            1. ” the difference is going to be who the playmakers are.” – He mentions finding the play-makers.
            2.” We have some wideouts that we got to get involved to be as successful as we want to be”. – It seems Kirby’s focus is a little more on players than plays but he does mention ‘getting the right players involved’, which sounds like he realizes we need a play-calling facelift.

            I know I don’t want another season of under-performing talented players. I know our record as a team was successful, I’m speaking of meeting the full potential of the talent we have recruited.

            Did Kirby really mention the TEs among the skilled players? Must be a misprint.

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  3. HirsuteDawg
    April 16, 2020 at 1:48 PM

    Nah, he means it. Man ball, Man, man ball.

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  4. rabe76
    April 16, 2020 at 2:11 PM

    Fear not. Every successful coach from Saban to Bellichick would tell you “players not plays.” So would every crappy coach. Every coach adapts his scheme to his available talent. Some just have better schemes and are way, way better at evaluating their talent

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    • Derek
      April 16, 2020 at 4:03 PM

      There are so many pieces to good coaching:

      identifying the talent you need for specific purposes
      motivating talent
      making sure your calls/scheme/design fit what the player(s) can actually do
      knowing where to take risks and when not to
      instill confidence
      scare some guys
      encourage other guys
      piss off other guys
      if you aren’t equipped as the HC to do one or more of those things, have someone around that is
      be hyper-competitive 24/7/365
      quickly identify and execute adjustments when the expected unexpected occurs

      I think all of those things are harder in the NFL. In my view, comparing Nick to Bill does a disservice to Bill. Like SOS said, how hard is it to win when you’ve always got the best roster? The NFL is just a totally different animal then college football in terms of the gaps between rosters and what you can do to alter any gaps.

      Liked by 1 person

  5. Matt
    April 16, 2020 at 4:06 PM

    I think you are overreacting to a trite bit of coach speak. Manball is dead.

    Having said that: I really question the narrative that the problem last year was purely coaching. You’re so obsessed with proving Derek’s “jimmies and joes” take wrong that you’re painting yourself into a position just as reductive. Coley wasn’t an elite playcaller, but then neither was Cheney and he had a great deal more success. Why? Perhaps because players do, in fact, enable plays.

    Fromm could never throw the deep ball terribly effectively or throw under pressure, but in ’17 and ’18 he had several speedy targets who could get separation on intermediate routes and serious YAC on quick RPOs and screens. And then that receiving production is gone for ’19, and so is Fromm’s safety net.

    From that point it’s not rocket science for an opposing DC. If their receivers can’t consistently beat their man and their QB can’t consistently hit them when they do then you can get back to the prime directive of stuffing the run.

    I will grant that a better coach than Coley could have schemed some guys open and had more success, but there was ceiling on last year’s team given the limitations at QB and WR and there’s no conceptual “wrinkle” that could get them past that.

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    • spur21
      April 16, 2020 at 5:18 PM

      That may be a valid argument but we under performed with better than average talent. I think our offensive talent was not coached up and the scheme didn’t seem to fit their talents.

      I expect a much better offense this year. I also think Monken will hold his staff accountable and demand they get their shit together or find another job.

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  6. J.G.
    April 16, 2020 at 5:38 PM

    Um, how about “players AND plays”? That sounds good to me.

    Come to think of it, though, “players, not plays” is the perfect summary of Coley’s year as OC.

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  7. MGW
    April 16, 2020 at 6:39 PM

    You’re always going to be reliant on your best players, and lean on them as much as you can without being one dimensional.

    Monken seems to have a history of annually scheming to his players’ strengths. I don’t Kirby’s comment conflicts with that.

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