You say yes and I say no. You say stop and I say go, go, go.

Zen and the art of winning college football games:

“It used to be that good defense beats a good offense. Good defense doesn’t beat good offense anymore,” Saban said. “It’s just like last week. Georgia has as good a defense as we do an offense, and we scored 41 points on them [in a 41-24 Alabama win]. That’s not the way it used to be. It used to be if you had a good defense, other people weren’t going to score. You were always going to be in the game. I’m telling you. It ain’t that way anymore.”

Kirby Smart ain’t buying what Tuscaloosa Yoda is selling, though.  At least sort of.

“I think if you look at recent history, elite offenses have certainly done well in the Playoff and have really won most of the championships,” Smart said. “If you look across the board at the biggest offensive numbers and the output of those offensive numbers, whether it be Clemson, whether it be Alabama, whether it be LSU, I would argue that each one of those teams had pretty good defenses, so it’s not a clear-cut question, it’s not a clear-cut answer.”

Smart said that there’s a lot of factors that are important for a team to be successful in today’s game.

“It’s not easy to say this or that,” Smart said. “There’s a lot of factors that go into it, but scoring offense and being able to score points is a tremendous factor, and a lot of the offenses have been ahead. The really good offenses have been ahead of the really good defenses, I don’t disagree with that. But, if you look across the board, there’s some teams that have really dynamic offenses and don’t have defenses, they struggle, they struggle when they go play really good teams.

Smart did state that it’s important for teams to have both, though.

“You’re really looking to have both, but I do respect that Clemson’s won championships with good defenses, and Alabama, when they won and beat us, they had a dynamic offense, but they had a good defense,” Smart said. “Then, when you go to LSU last year, nobody even talks about their defense, but they obviously had a good defense because they’ve got players playing all over the NFL.”

There’s some misdirection going on there.  Saban isn’t saying today’s great teams don’t play defense; he’s just saying, push comes to shove, offense wins championships these days.  Kirby sounds like a man who isn’t quite ready to give up the dream ($$).

“Nobody wants a 9-6 game. They don’t enjoy that. I think it’s a great thing. I think it’s physical toughness, I think it’s a rock ’em-sock ’em, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that. I think it could be a great game and be 9-6, but nobody’s entertained by that. So the world we live in today is entertained by points.”

Kirbs, did you ever watch that 2015 Georgia-Missouri game?  Great is about the last word I’d associate with that debacle.  But I digress.

“So I don’t know when they’ll catch up,” Smart said. “I don’t know if they’ll catch up. I really don’t care if they catch up. Our job is to do the best job defending those kind of offenses that we can. And we want to defend them better than others. And I think we can do that. I think if you recruit well and you have good enough athletes, you have great enough players, you can defend great offenses better than everyone else. It doesn’t mean you’re going to stop them. But it does mean you can defend them better than everybody else.”

All well and good, but even Smart goes on to admit “you better be able to score yourself.”

The thing is, it’s not as if Georgia has to be among the elite of the offensive elite in order to be a legitimate playoff team.  Look at the top ten teams in SP+ this week.

Screenshot_2020-10-28 College football SP+ rankings after Week 8 How the Big Ten's return shakes things up

If Georgia were able to improve its offensive ranking into the low twenties or high teens, it would be right there with Alabama and Clemson.  Surely that’s not an impossible task.

56 Comments

Filed under Georgia Football, Strategery And Mechanics

56 responses to “You say yes and I say no. You say stop and I say go, go, go.

  1. It depends on whether Stetson or one of our other very inexperienced quarterbacks can mature in time.

    I can’t recall a season where uga started a green qb and flourished.

    Like

    • Biggen

      Jake Fromm from 2017 says hello!

      Liked by 7 people

      • Don’t confuse everyone with facts, Biggen. Didn’t you know the only reason we won a single game was that we had Chubb and Michel with a defense? A number of commenters have made it a point to revise history by saying Kirby should have pulled Fromm for Eason when he got healthy.

        Liked by 2 people

        • classiccitycanine

          Kirby should have absolutely pulled Fromm for Eason. Jacob could have done everything Jake was asked to do with the added benefit of an NFL arm. We would also likely have Fields as our QB right now.

          Liked by 2 people

          • I remember feeling very uncomfortable 2 drives in with Eason against App State as the offense flailed around.

            3 plays, 1 yard – punt
            3 plays, 3 yards – punt
            3 plays, -1 yard – injured

            I’m sure you were saying that in 2017 as the team continued to improve.

            Liked by 2 people

        • PTC DAWG

          Those folks who advocated for pulling Fromm for Eason are on DRUGS.

          Like

  2. gastr1

    The more he says about this, the less I believe Kirby Smart gets it.

    Liked by 2 people

  3. The question is how do you get there. He clearly is saying you have to be good on both sides of the ball (you don’t have to be elite) to win a national title.

    Which is easier in today’s game? Become an explosive run-oriented offense or pass-oriented offense. I would suggest going back to looking at the 2012 offense for some clues (no, I’m not advocating for the return of Mike Bobo). We rushed for 183 yards per game and passed for 285 yards per game. In 14 games, we eclipsed the 40 point barrier 8 times. That’s the formula – a team that could stretch and spread the field in the passing game and gash you in the run game. There’s no reason with our talent level across the field that we can’t do that.

    All of that with a QB who never threw a meaningful pass in the NFL because he was too short.

    Liked by 2 people

    • Corch Irvin Meyers, New USC Corch (2021)

      Except it’s not 2012 anymore.

      Like

      • That offense statistically was better than the 2017 offense (arguably, the 2012 offense was the best Georgia offense in history). That offense could have outscored Alabama a couple of weeks ago.

        I think Kirby’s point is that you need to be elite on one side of the ball and really good on the other. We just have to get at least really good on the offensive side.

        Like

        • Corch Irvin Meyers, New USC Corch (2021)

          But his point continues to be wrong. You need to be elite on offense. You only have to be good on defense. The days of protecting your defense with a “balanced” offense are over. The rules favor offenses far too much.

          Liked by 2 people

          • Sure … in today’s game if you have your preference, build an elite offense. My point is that an offense with the skill of the 2012 offense would be good enough paired with an elite defense to be a championship quality team.

            Like

    • Got Cowdog

      It would warm the cockles of my heart if Kirby would say “Defense is my thing, I love it and NOBODY screws with my defense. But…. you have to score points, too. That’s why I hired Todd Monken.”
      Probably de-pucker few folks here on the blog, too.

      Liked by 7 people

    • RangerRuss

      And there it is, double e. Keep doing the right thing, working hard, showing your best effort every day, constantly trying to improve and VOILA! It’s not a surprise when it happens as a man makes his own luck.

      Liked by 2 people

  4. 79dawg

    Not a lot of context around this quote, but is talking about offense or defense when he begins the last quote, but it is just word salad. And at the end, it does not matter if we defend Alabama better than everyone else – at the end of the day, we may in fact defend them than everyone else, but that and a lousy offense will still get us beat…
    As I alluded to yesterday, he is diggin’ his own grave with this sort of talk…
    (P.S. I doubt I will live long enough to be in Sanford Stadium for a sh***ier win than 2015 Missouri….)

    Liked by 3 people

  5. Corch Irvin Meyers, New USC Corch (2021)

    Why do I feel like I’m Bruno Kirby in the scene from City Slickers where Billy Crystal is trying to teach Daniel Stern that you can record something you’re not watching on a VCR on a different channel than channel 3?

    “He doesn’t get it! He’ll never get it!”

    Kirby refuses to get it. All the evidence is right there. He keeps getting beat by teams with much better offenses than his and with lesser defenses than his, but he refuses to see the correlation. This is the depressing Groundhogs Day (to use another movie example) nightmare we feared.

    Liked by 1 person

    • RangerRuss

      Kirby is gonna get there, pal. The problem is the main competition just so happens to be as strong and smart as him with the addition of being the favorite goat of the home boys. Don’t worry your moments away.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Even Saban didn’t really get it until Tua bailed his ass out in the second half 3 years ago. Sure, they’d moved more spread, and were certainly not running old school offense with Hurts…but they weren’t great on offense with him.

        Like

  6. theotherdoug

    Saban was down at the half, but still had the upper hand because his offense could score from anywhere, and his defense could hold our offense to zero points in the second half.

    That gave him two chances to pull out the victory. He could win a boat race or the defensive battle that went to the last play of the game. Kirby’s only chance was for the defense to keep the game close and win the final drive.

    That’s what has changed. The New Bama can win with defense or offense, and is always in the game because their offense can score quickly. ManBall has to control the game for 4 qtrs, and that beats lesser teams but not teams with equal talent.

    In the 4th qtr nobody thought Stetson Bennett could lead us to a W without some crazy luck. Yeah, it’s easy to think Smart is up to his old ManBall tricks, but it’s more likely that he’s playing a 4th string walk on that can’t orchestrate a 4th qtr comeback against a Bama level team. Arkansas? No problem. Bama? It gets ugly.

    Smart and Monken know what they have in Stetson, and if he’s the starter for the rest of the season they will play ManBall, win the East, and hope for some luck in Atlanta. Newman or Daniels was the plan, but they’re not under center.

    Liked by 4 people

  7. classiccitycanine

    When I try to translate Kirby’s messages about the offense I come away with a few possibilities:
    (A) Kirby still doesn’t get offense.
    (B) Kirby never admits program-level mistakes because that would undermine trust in the Process.
    (C) Kirby’s trying to transition his offense with publicly admitting (B).
    (D) Kirby’s using his platform to tell all of his players to keep working and not worry about coaching X’s and O’s.

    Liked by 1 person

  8. Jim Cook

    How long until our current 5 star quarterback on the roster admits he also made a mistake and transfers?

    Liked by 1 person

    • jgssgj

      I’m worried that Kirby is getting or has gotten the rep as the opposite of a QB whisperer. In 2020, that’s REAL bad.

      Like

  9. originaluglydawg

    Since holding the pass rushers has become legal (or at least largely ignored), defenses have been at a growing disadvantage. This isn’t the only reason for the plethora of points being scored, but it’s a big one. It gives QBs enough time to pick defenses apart. There are other factors too, but this one is deceptively big.
    Also, it seems defensive holding is called more often than offensive holding. I think that’s crazy.
    Seems refs can call holding subjectively and many do.

    Liked by 4 people

    • Got Cowdog

      I was thinking the same thing. Lots of pushing off by receivers and defensive pass interference can be called on just about every play if the official sees fit. Throw in the holding you mentioned and even an elite defense is hamstrung.

      Liked by 2 people

    • Every rule is tilted toward offense. Even the rules designed to balance it (ineligible downfield, OPI, holding) aren’t enforced consistently. In particular, it’s time to require two feet down with control for a catch.

      Liked by 1 person

  10. ASEF

    A top 5 offense and top 20 defense will take you a lot further than a top 5 D and top 20 O. That’s just the way the game is built these days. The rules favor offenses. The rules interpretations favor offenses.

    Kirby has a hole at the center of his roster. It’s the most important position in the game today, and that hole makes it more difficult to take advantage of all the structural advantages that the rules grant offenses.

    Liked by 5 people

  11. godawgs1701

    Surely to God this isn’t his pitch to quarterbacks, running backs, and receivers…

    Liked by 2 people

  12. Xon Hostetter

    I’m in Zoom court and haven’t read prior comments so I apologize: but to me this sounds like (most optimistic interpretation I can give) in-season Kirby vs off-season Kirby. In-season, everything he says is a message to his team and full of 20 years ago coachspeak. Off-season, he’ll start explaining himself and say things like “I want to score 60 every game. You obviously have to do that. We’re gonna do what we have to do to get there.”

    Liked by 3 people

  13. stoopnagle

    Fuck it, let’s just beat the brakes off Kentucky.

    Liked by 2 people

  14. siskey

    My 2 cents is that Kirby knows Bennett’s limitations but Bennett is better than the other options.
    I think that the targeting rule is also hurting defenses. The secondary players are a little slow and more cautious and that leads to it being easier to pass the ball.
    Remember the play last year against Florida, Reed almost had an interception on a pass thrown in the middle of the field because he went for the ball but ten years ago he would have had the perfect opportunity to deliver a Steve Atwater type hit to the Florida receiver.

    Liked by 1 person

    • I just don’t believe SBIV is better than a healthy JT Daniels. If that’s the case, the recruiting services and coaches across the country don’t know what they’re doing.

      Liked by 4 people

      • theotherdoug

        There has to be something up with Daniels. Otherwise he would be taking some snaps in mop up or be the #2 guy coming in when Stetson is out for a play.

        Like

  15. The 2017 team had a great defense but it still looked like as sieve in the Rose Bowl and NC. It still made big plays, too. Seems a little of both to me and we’ve seen the results since Kirby has been here.

    Why the hell would you not strive to be great at both? I get the complementary ball thing but that should go both ways. If your offense isn’t scoring then that puts more pressure on your D to get stops. Great D can win a lot of games and even dominate your division but you better be able to score a lot of points in the conference championships and beyond.

    Liked by 3 people

    • W Cobb Dawg

      The question is whether an O should be so concerned about protecting their defense that the approach is adjusted to run clock all game, maximize field position, etc. That’s all well and good if you assume every game may be close and against equivalent talent.

      But it seems to me Brady & Burrow were focused on moving the ball and scoring. They maximized the talent gap over opponents. Protecting their D was an afterthought.

      One has to choose between those extremes. Your O concentrates on scoring, or they have a buffet of objectives.

      Like

  16. Is it just me, is this a surprising amount of candor from Coach Saban. Refreshingly so.

    Liked by 1 person

  17. Here’s the ugly truth. Our best chance at a championship is with the coach who takes over when the powers that be realize Kirby isn’t the answer. Cupboard will be stocked.

    Like