To belabor a point I made in my previous post about Trump, the NFL and the national anthem (something that’s been largely ignored in the debate in the comments here), many of you who make the complaint in the header ignore the inconvenient history of organized sports’ involvement in politics.
Pete Rozelle, the commissioner of the NFL, and Spike Eckert and Bowie Kuhn, the commissioners of baseball, worked to put their sports on record in support of the Vietnam War, while laboring to silence those in the game who disagreed. While many believe that before the protests of the last year, the national anthem and other patriotic elements of sporting events symbolized unity, they are actually remnants of this campaign to interject sports into a bitterly divisive political debate.
Like it or not, sports isn’t some sort of safe zone from politics and it hasn’t been for some time.
When some of you tell me to stick to sports, what you’re really saying is that you want GTP to avoid the politics you don’t embrace. Sorry, but that isn’t how it works. Or at least it doesn’t appear to work that way when I see political observations injected into a comment thread about purely football posts. I don’t have a problem with that; it would be nice to see the same courtesy extended in the other direction. A little tolerance goes a long way, tone-wise.
Get The Picture 
This should rile things up, thinks I will get some popcorn & coke…sit back and watch.
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Same here. I don’t have the energy to venture out into this street fight today.
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Don’t think anyone is gonna change anybody’s opinion on here. I have my own opinion and I’m not going to try to change anyone’s view. In the grand scheme of things, it is not that important to me…. it does not bother me in the least if someone else’s opinion is different. It does not affect me, my world will not change….can tune in or out when I want, I have control. But it is entertaining in some ways
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It is a sad day in America. Protest/free-speech has it’s time and place, and so does respect and honor. We have much to work on, but much has been accomplished. As a veteran, it saddens me to see issues related to individual actions or opinions to be passed on to our nation as a whole and its symbols as the object of disrepect. We can’t even unite for two minutes in gratitude to God and honor to our nation and to those who made and are making it possible.
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I think days like we had in Charlottesville are much sadder than watching a bunch of millionaires protect their brand because man baby needs an applause line in alabama.
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Same here. I had fun pushing some buttons in the other post, don’t have the time today.
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I threw in my .02 and then ran. I still wish I would have gotten the O/U on comments though. I would have put it at 250 and then placed a 5-1 on the over. I just bought Vandy tiks and a room at the Hilton in Brentwood, so it would have been nice to pay that off the Amex.
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Of course it’s never been free from politics. And the people who complain about it are not complaining about NASCAR issuing a statement backing Trump’s position – they’re applauding it. Much like these people who cry about actors weighing in on politics had no Problem with Clint Eastwood’s performance at the RNC that one year – it’s never been about keeping politics out of things, it’s about keeping their echo chamber free from outside opinions.
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This all day
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This so much. We have a fucking reality TV star as the President of the United States for crying out loud. Celebrity and sports have never been, and never will be, separate from politics as long as athletes and celebrities are American citizens. People live in their echo chambers these days and get their fee-fees hurt when that echo chamber doesn’t extend to every aspect of life.
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Tracking
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I AM OUTRAGED THAT WOULD SAY STUFF I DON’T AGREE WITH GIVEN HOW MUCH MONEY I HAVE INVESTED IN YOUR WEBSITE.
To me, the stick to sports mantra for the game itself, espn, etc, applies to all sides of politics. I don’t want anyone injecting their opinion into things, as I view it as a respite from the current politicization of everything. That there was a time when “Sports” inserted themselves into politics, does not change the fact that over the last 10-15 years, politics has remained largely outside the public eye within sports.
As those lines cross here in the blog, I am much less bothered because I have the opportunity to simply ignore, skip, or engage. I come here for opinion, interesting links, and oft times interesting discussions. I certainly am not one to tell you to stay in your lane or anything else about how you manage this place. I just wish the live sports events could provide that respite.
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The problem is that most Americans know way more about sports than they do about how their government works. They can rattle off stat after stat but can’t name the Supreme Court Justices.
They prefer to keep their heads in the sand while we indescrimenately drone strike killing civilians, cops murder fellow citizens with impunity (with video evidence to boot), monied interests threaten the very fabric of our democracy, etc. Sorry Francis but some of us care enough to interrupt your safe space to tell you that the house is on freaking fire.
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Nice post, Joe.
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If anything, given the current situation of news filter bubbles and self affirmation, politics needs to be more prevalent in sports. Its one of the few places where people from vastly different situations and beliefs can find common ground. It will only be in places like that that we have hope of understanding things from other people’s perspectives.
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What is the record for number of responses to a post?
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Liberals and blacks and other undesirables need to stick to the entertaining, shut up and stay out of the politics.
Trump is rich and white. He can inject his opinion into whatever he wants.
After all we all know who the REAL American patriots are around here:
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No Derek, just stupid people that think paved roads is socialism.
😘
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I’ll leave the stupid people expertise to you.
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I can’t believe that anybody would criticize McCain’s political positions when the man is dying. Just as I can’t believe that anybody would criticize Cory Booker’s political positions when the man is black. Or criticize Hillary Clinton, who is a woman.
Some people should simply be beyond reproach. The fact that McCain has spent the majority of his life leaching off taxpayers, warmongering, and aligning himself with Democrats to advocate for stupid bipartisan positions should all be forgotten. Can’t we just Move On?
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As I watched Joe express exasperation that the people he grew up with and represented lacked any decency whatsoever, my thought was: dude, you thought that they had decency? Seriously?
Thank you for confirming it.
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Exactly. I mean, dying liberal politicians should either be applauded as heroes or left alone as they do their lifetime achievement lap. In no way should they be treated as politicians. That just wouldn’t be decent.
FWIW, exactly how many strata of your superiors do you recognize? Politicians are better than you. Dying politicians are better than politicians. Are dead politicians better than dying politicians? I would argue so. How about aspiring politicians? I certainly agree that they’re all better than you. I’m just curious about your authoritarian caste system beliefs.
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I will answer you by reminding you of this:
In 1992 Admiral Stockdale was nominated as Ross Perot’s VP. He appeared at a debate and people made fun of him because he was elderly and a bit awkward. It pissed me the fuck off then and I’m angry thinking about it now 35 years later.
During the Vietnam War Admiral Stockdale was taken prisoner of war and rather than being put on TV as propaganda for the NV government, he gouged his scalp with a razor and smashed his face with a stool so he would be unpresentable for a propaganda film his captors wanted to make. He broke a window in a torture room and slashed his wrist with the glass shards to show he’d die before capitulating.
That guy doesn’t get any shit from you, me or anyone else ever and anybody who thinks its ok to give that guy shit should be beaten and badly until they either perish our find their humanity, decency and patriotism in a puddle of their own blood.
You shake his hand and say “thank you” or, if you just can’t because he said or did something you disagree with, then you just shut the fuck up.
Has that been made clear enough for you?
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It’s clear. But it’s bullshit.
I’m no particular fan of military service. But I absolutely have sympathy for those killed or captured during service. And it’s certainly boorish to criticize someone for the consequences of torture during captivity. It was boorish for people to criticize Stockdale’s lack of polish. It was also boorish for people in Clinton’s campaign to criticize McCain’s inexperience with smart phones when his thumbs don’t work well because of torture.
But that’s where it ends. Arguing that McCain should get a pass for helping to create ISIS because he was a Navy POW a few decades ago is just stupid.
If McCain wants to be beyond reproach, he should retire and fight his cancer at home with his family. Then, everyone should leave him alone. But if he wants to be a politician, take stances, and scuttle legislation, he should be a big boy and expect to face some criticism from those that don’t like his actions.
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I don’t think “a pass” or “criticism” was what Joe was talking about and neither am I. Its about respect and decency and humanity, not infallibility. Nowhere did Joe or I say that McCain should be immune from disagreement. After all I voted for neither McCain nor Stockdale. However, they are entitled to your and the President’s and his crowd’s respect. That is all.
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But Trump’s “attacks” were simply acknowledging that McCain killed the Obamacare repeal bill. That’s it. What part of political disagreement is disrespectful and inhuman? It sounds like more left wing hysteria.
To paraphrase Joe Scarborough, “How were these people raised, to believe that a dying man can’t scuttle his party’s legislation without comment? I’m getting the vapors!”
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Joe was a GOP congressmen from one of the most conservative districts in America and wasn’t it Lindsey who got the vapors?
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Come on. That was a past life. You want to count him as a conservative? He’s a typical MSNBC host who thinks that Trump is LITERALLY Hitler!
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He’s most certainly a conservative. Like most of America, he doesn’t like Trump. Not everyone who calls themselves a conservative goose steps to Mein Fuhrgrabber and don’t think that a conservative is anyone democrats find abhorrent.
How many elected GOP members would breath a sigh of relief if that asshat dropped over from a coronary today? My guess is well over half.
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Well, I suppose that, if everyone to the right of Maxine Waters is a Nazi, then I guess everyone to the right of Che Guevera could be considered a conservative. But your classifications aren’t exactly mainstream. For example, if you think MSNBC would voluntarily give a paycheck to a conservative, you’re a bigger idiot than I give you credit for.
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You’re so stupid it literally hurts: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YlJiAOt3zBc
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So, Joe approved of the Bush/Clinton/Obama foreign policy 13 years ago? Why, that’s as conservative as it gets. I guess since Irving Kristol was once a communist, he should be considered an immutable leftist, right? Because it would be so stupid it literally hurts to consider him a neoconservative, right? Bless your heart.
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So MSNBC pays people who call themselves conservatives because there’s no way they would pay a conservative but they did in this case because he isn’t really conservative and they know that because you guys talked and you said “hey MSNBC you can pay that guy because really, he’s not a conservative he just says so” and then they said “oh ok in that case we’ll pay him to say he’s a conservative on our network so long as flatulent hard-on says he isn’t really one because the point is to promote conservative viewpoints and to pay for it so long as somebody like you thinks he really isn’t anyway” but if you told MSNBC said that he really was one then they wouldn’t pay him and your not stupid?
I mean your either stupid or insane. They wrote checks to a former GOP congressmen who refers to himself as conservative and you say MSNBC wouldn’t pay one of those. Its truly remarkable the pretzel of preposterous propositions you can hold true and also suggest that you have the capacity for lucid thought. You should seek help for your delusions.
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It sure is entertaining to watch your brain fail to work. Yep, it sure is impossible for people to change their political views over time. Also, the contraction for “you are” is you’re. Just FYI.
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So MSNBC and Joe are like symbiotic organisms whose political and monetary choices change in concert over time? Interestingly dumb theory.
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I thank Senator McCain for his service, but it’s important that we all be allowed to advocate for our political positions. If one side is silenced they won’t feel like the decision reached is legitimate.
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We’re your guests, Senator. I have no problem when you put up a post that ties sports and politics. I have a problem when people say things online (call someone a racist or a communist) to one another they would never say face to face especially if they knew the person. Debate the merits, sure. Just stay out of the cesspool of personal attack.
Regarding the NFL, I have no problem with those who choose to participate in the protest. I have a problem when those who exercise their right expect consequence-free free speech from the consumer. It seems the NFL brass decided to support the players thinking that the fans will forget and come back. It seems it’s going to be very difficult for the NFL to bring many back after this.
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This is my problem: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iA86imHKCMw
These owners had zero problems with this guy until he messed with their money. Now they have an issue. No one cared about insulting a war hero or a family who lost a son at war or celebrated sexual assault or called people marching with tiki torches chanting “Jews will not replace us” “very fine people.” Nope. None of that moved Dan Snyder or Bob Kraft or Jerry Jones to act. It was only when he came after the NFL did they show any concern about the the content of the speech of this treasonous, narcissistic scumbag.
First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.
Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
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Dude, your eloquence is exceeded only by the truth you speak.
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Follow the $$$
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Mic drop
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Back in the old days, the AJC used to run “participation charts”…who played for each team, or at least the numbers. I wonder if somewhere those charts are available somewhere in the data mine you dig in?
This is a real question and considerably more relevant than someone who tells you to stick to sports.
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I somewhat disagree. I watch sports for entertainment. I watch movies for entertainment.
But jsomeone who has captured my attention with their capacity for entertainment or athletics is not necessarily the same person I’m interested in hearing opine in things political, or even social.
It’s akin to being invited to dinner by an acquaintance and having them spring a multi level marketing pitch on you.
In your case, I’m happy to oblige, or even occasionally engage, because your thoughts are supported and your arguments are reasonable.
But I don’t give a rats ass what a professional athlete or actor thinks about damn near anything.
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I tried to be careful not to paint everyone here with the same broad brush. For those of you who sincerely want separation for separation’s sake, there is a reasonable solution: skip the posts you don’t want to read.
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Along those same lines I think a reasonable alternative to watching the NFL, movies, TV shows or other forms of entertainment that have political content, and content one disagrees with, is to stop watching.
I think that alternative will be exercised more and more.
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“I think that alternative will be exercised more and more.”
That’s what I believe is scaring the hell out of the suits in the “not-for-profit” NFL offices on Park Avenue in NYC. The owners have made their bed and now have to hope fans will forgive and forget. This situation is completely different from the MLB strike of ’94 that cancelled the World Series. The fans realized the 2 sides were fighting each other for the share of the money pie … eventually, the fans forgave them for ending the season. Many NFL fans look at these protests as a direct attack on them and American culture. I say this as a person who spends Sunday afternoons with my family or at the golf course rather than in front of the TV watching the pro game.
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Personally I stopped watching the NFL years ago, and I haven’t missed it.
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Oh that is so admirable of you to mail yourself on that cross. What a martyr for freedom you are by playing golf and ignoring the injustices done to people who can’t afford to attend your country club. What a patriot!
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You don’t know me, what I do or what I don’t do in the community. You don’t know how I contribute the money I earn to charitable causes I support. I was making the comment I didn’t watch the NFL before other than with a passing interest because of other priorities and was commenting on the impact this seems to be having on the business of the NFL especially with its core fan base. The tone of your comment is exactly what’s wrong with the political discourse in this country right now on both sides.
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Thank goodness the world has you to patrol football message boards to enforce wokedness and make sure everyone is always thinking about these injustices.
And everything is now right with the world.
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But I must know everything about UGA football!!!
Like, when is Eason planning to transfer to AU?
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Kirby will block it 🙂
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Not if he goes the Juco Route
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If Eason transferred, he’s not going JUCO. He’ll be in Seattle or Pullman, WA (or Miami, FL).
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Ask your bag man.
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Sorry, War Eagle. Haven’t heard from you in such a long period that I forget that you discuss football openly and my sarcasm font wasn’t on.
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LOL. No harm here. Pretty interesting times at AU.
Chuck Person of all people. By all accounts a good guy, obviously wealthy, and successful in life.
Interesting times.
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What if Auburn started deploying the bagman to Athens to make connections in the Athens Clarke PD?
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I think the bag man is looking for BB coaches.
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What’s the rush WarD? He’s gonna have to sit out a season anyway
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“But I don’t give a rats ass what a professional athlete or actor thinks about damn near anything.”
Pretty much this.
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Well said…
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What is this “tolerance” you speak of?
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I know, I know. Sigh.
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This is the Comrade Pussygrabber regime.
Tolerence is only practiced in the hamlet of Covfefe, Nambia.
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Since it’s not Compton, I don’t know anything about it.
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That is until there is a counter view. That’s how it works. Apparently I wasn’t the only person who interjected that sports talk was the reason for reading. Paging Kieth Olberman!
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The players have every right to protest and the owners have every right to tell them whether they can protest or not. The sad thing is that the vast majority of these players don’t even know what they’re protesting, as evidenced by so few being able to remotely articulate what they’re for or against.
Bottom line, as long as you’re willing to blame someone else for your lot in life, nothing will ever change for you.
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You want to back up that sweeping generality with some real evidence or is that what you want to believe because you just don’t like their method of protest?
I saw plenty of locker room and post-game interviews this past weekend and in weeks past with players very clearly articulating what their feelings were and why they did what they did and are very aware of the consequences.
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Please show me one of these clearly articulated, fact-based answers you speak of. I haven’t seen one yet. Again, no one is saying they don’t have the right to disrespect the flag, just like we viewers have the right not to watch the NFL…and not watch is exactly what America is doing…check out the ratings bud.
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If you can’t be bothered to educate yourself about the topic before injecting an uninformed opinion, then you’re never going to have your echo chamber challenged. There were literally dozens of videos of interviews floating around social media on Sunday. Here’s the problem with folks like you. You’ve been empowered with the dumbing down of “embrace debate” to make sweeping declarative statements without being required to do that actual fucking research and then when you get called out on it, you demand that the person who rightly called you out provide proof.
However – after a 3 second Google search, here’s a summary of a few from Sunday for you to chew on with your lazy ass argument of them being inarticulate about what they’re protesting. Note that quite possibly the most articulate one came from none other than former Georgia TE Ben Watson. I’d also recommend checking out Chris Long’s interview. There was also a player from the Jets whose name is escaping me that got quite emotional when talking about it.
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Josh Norman said “we had to do this because of the tyranny we face from the POTUS”.
Thank you for proving my point.
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The players have had their constitutional right to free speech directly challenged by the POTUS. I believe the founding fathers would have described that as tyranny as well.
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No one challenged their right to protest and are we really at the point where words are considered “tyrannical” or could it be that he has no idea what the definition of tyranny actually is? I suggest you and Josh Brown look up the definition of tyranny.
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“No one has challenged their right to protest”? Are you fucking kidding me?
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No, I’m not. Everyone knows they have the right to do it, , but the POTUS was calling for their employers, to throw them out on their asses, which they also have the right to do. Try and keep up.
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No he isn’t because he didn’t read that as well. Since he can’t get it by osmosis, then it must be wrong. The “earth is warming” warning with evidence of incredible increase in CO2 that’s becoming evident from the ocean’s warming and releasing CO2 plus the Arctic permafrost rapidly melting and CO2 releasing into the environment doesn’t strike a chord in his lexicon because he doesn’t understand it if Fox news tells him otherwise.
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Wow, that was quite a veer off topic, but I’ll play.
The whole scam that the earth’s warming, which no one denies, is caused by man, is starting to unravel. The mandatory group think on the left is hilarious and frightening all at the same time.
http://reason.com/blog/2017/01/04/georgia-tech-climatologist-judith-curry
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Exactly. If he’s not willing to gamble tens, or hundreds, of trillions of dollars on the notion that man is the majority contributor to global warming, and that global warming will be catastrophic, then he just doesn’t understand science.
All those third world people who will die from poverty and disease can take solace in the knowledge that our beach houses will be protected from rising tides for another century or two. Bless their hearts.
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My info doesn’t come from the left. It comes mostly from NOAA docs and individual scientists that I speak to on a daily basis. Many of those scientists communicate directly to scientists in the field who are providing the testing data.
We are miles ahead of the data that I just provided in summary form (and almost in anecdotal form) with new data that’s fairly scary. It has to do with the Arctic weather that we have grown to expect each year that affects large weather events across this country and the action of North Atlantic water currents that are influenced by water temp and recirculation events. Water column data indicates that upwelling currents necessary for fishery food and current regeneration may be failing since the coldness that made the water columns of N. A. dive in a large underwater waterfall aren’t working as they have in the past. This all points to air temperature change that affects water column temperature change causing the currents to change; all in a viscious circle that outlines the affects of early global warming. These all work to increase CO2 that absorbs and or deflects sunlight essential to primary productivity that runs the worlds food supply.
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When did POTUS advocate that the protesting players be incarcerated or fined for their protests? I haven’t seen that one yet.
I did see him advocate (incorrectly IMO) for their employers to terminate their employment.
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Ben Watson has been clear and consistent going back to the aftermath of Ferguson. He has truly been a DGD we can all be proud of through all of this. He hasn’t kneeled during the national anthem (and has called out those who have) and has used his platform as a professional athlete wisely to discuss the issues.
I proudly have a copy of Under Our Skin bought and signed at the UGA Bookstore on my bookshelf in my home office. He’s a guy we could all look to as a role model.
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Bingo…”He hasn’t kneeled during the national anthem (and has called out those who have)”
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Isn’t kneeling (with your hand over your heart no less) typically considered a sign of reverence and humility? Why is this so offensive? I thought the rightwingers were the tough ones who are so against political correctness and is liberals were all snowflakes?
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So what’s the point of kneeling? What are they protesting? They certainly don’t know.
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You’ve already been proven wrong on this and yet you continue to spit the same false talking point? Know what that makes you? I’d go with “jackass,” personally.
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It is, unless you don’t intend it to be. The players aren’t intending to honor the flag or the anthem. They’re protesting against them. At the risk of sounding racist, let’s call a spade a spade.
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Being forced to do something is not a sign of respect.
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Who is forcing them to do anything? They can stand to respect the flag and/or anthem if they wish. They can kneel to protest against them if they wish. Players have come down on both sides of the issue. Voluntarily.
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They’re leaving it up to the high schools to force them to do something.
Idiots might as well let the ACLU know where to send the process server.
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And I’ll add – nobody is saying you have to like what they’re doing or why they’re doing it for one second. That’s your God-given right as an American. However – your dismissiveness of their sincerity because you can’t be bothered to do some basic research is this entire country’s problem in a nutshell.
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Or perhaps you forgot how this whole thing started…with a guy, half-white mind you, who wore socks that depicted the police as pigs.
You can remove my foot from your ass anytime.
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You are a lost fucking cause, my man. I’m done with you today.
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Aaaaaaaand that’s the ball game folk’s!
Conceding while using insults and profanity…as good as it gets.
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Brother – it’s not your overwhelming intelligent rebuttals that are making me drop the issue. It’s the fact that you’re like arguing with a 5 year old and still won’t address the original comment I challenged and disproved and instead just changed the subject. Good luck to you.
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Disproved?
Josh Norman said “we had to do this because of the tyranny we face from the POTUS”.
Thank you for proving my point.
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Yeah you should stop engaging. He has no interest in honest engagement – evidenced by the fact that he conveniently ignores every point you made and then did research to find a Josh Norman quote in an attempt to prove his point (while ignoring yours) For every Josh Norman, there is a captain obvious who doesn’t know wtf he is talking about – is not interested in being informed.
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He provided the “research” you speak of evidence of how these players not only have a clue what they’re protesting, but articulate it very well.
He simply proved my point with his “evidence”. This is nothing but mob mentality and they literally have no idea what they’re protest is about. Again, this whole thing started because a half-white, mediocre qb in San Fran wanted to earn some street cred in the locker room by wearing socks that depicted cops as pigs.
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One person’s answer does not prove your point. The correct race for Colin Kaepernick is biracial. He responded to what he believed was police brutality. I also gave a copy of Ben Watson’s book. He articulates his complex an issue this is. He agrees the issues are real. Some of you decry the protest because you want to deny racism is an issue. If a white player misbehaves no in we calls him a whiny ungrateful brat or thug. Many fans disrespect the flag during the anthem by talking, continuing to their seats and wearing their hats. That disreoect is tolerated by other fans but a silent protest is an attack on the flag. I am an Army brat who grow up on military bases during the Vietnam War. I saw real dusrept to soldiers and this is not it. Calling them baby killers, spitting on soldiers, protesting around the bases they lived on that is disrespecting soldiers. I saw all of that.
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I asked for an example of a player articulating what they were protesting about and he provided me a clip of Josh Brown saying that he is protesting “the tyranny of what the POTUS said”. That, my friend, proves beyond a shadow of a doubt the following:
1. Josh Brown doesn’t know what the definition of tyranny is
2. IF this is the best example he can provide, then these players have no idea what they are protesting about and simply follow a mob mentality.
3. If this is about “racism” then why did this start with a player who is as much white as he is black, who chose to wear a pair of socks depicting cops as pig?
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Because unlike you all of him recognizes racism and he wanted to make a statement about it.
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You’ve perfectly captured the 60’s when tolerance went AWOL and folks with differing views were seriously disrespected. I may have memories that are even a little more vivid than yours and the purple heart tag on my car may attest to that. It was a time when we came back from Southeast Asia and immediately took off the uniform before leaving the base just because of the treatment that was very common in those days. It’s only been the last 10 years or so that I have even come to mention my military service outside of my family because of some of those unfortunate memories.
I’ve never had a problem with people who disagree with me as long as the disagreement is civil and not damaging. There are many reasons why folks thought that war was necessary and many reasons why others thought it wasn’t. I don’t regard either side as more or less patriotic as long at the position they took was rational. What, for me, is unpatriotic is the militant disrespect, the name calling, and the threats toward people with whom we disagree without a shred of rationality attached to it. I sometimes fear we might be headed back to the sixties and I promise you those were not good times.
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He literally cherry picked the Josh Norman comment from that entire Deadspin post and ignored the multitude of others because that one comment fits his world view. Again – it’s like arguing with a 5 year old that just keeps changing the argument rather than addressing the criticism.
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You’re right. I literally “cherry picked” the video HE sent me that was supposed to prove me wrong. Holy shit this is fun.
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Uh yeah – you literally grabbed the one comment out of like 20 that were in that link that supported your world view. That would practically be the textbook definition of cherry picking when your original contention was “the vast majority of these players don’t even know what they’re protesting, as evidenced by so few being able to remotely articulate what they’re for or against.” One comment out of many is not the vast majority, but sure – keep moving the goalposts.
Again – you’re being nothing more than a common troll trying to get a rise out of people that still never addressed the criticism of your original comment because you know there is no defense to it. Been fun playing with you.
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You referenced a Deadspin post as your proof. Your not ‘winning’ any argument if that is the best you can come up with. It’s like Derek posting youtube videos to prove his point. Stay twoke.
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They prove the point that there is a rational basis, i.e., evidence, upon which for people to rely upon and which supports a concern about the use of police force against minorities.
You may find people of color irrational and stupid who have a complete inability to understand the environment that they find themselves in and to act accordingly. There is a name for people like that: bigot.
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For crying out loud…Are you serious? Did you even click the link? The Deadspin post literally has a collection of videos from beat reporters and other media members with the interviews as well as quotes from the players on Sunday articulating why they chose to protest. How is that not proof that the players are articulating why they chose to protest which runs contrary to CO’s initial point that the vast majority of players hadn’t clearly articulated why they were protesting?
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“I lack the intellect, the temperament and the time to write books.”
Be honest, you have the time to write books…
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I think I know why they are protesting. Everything I have seen seems to boil it down to racial injustice and police brutality. Do you agree?
The problem for most people (believe me, I’m not that offended) is that they are disrespecting the national anthem and what it represents to make this point. We get it, its on the news every day. Its in our face constantly. The problem is that no one can actually solve their problem. People aren’t treated equally, they never have been and they never will. There is no equality. Life isn’t fair. They are trampling on the one thing in this world that actually grants them equality and it pisses people off.
It is unnecessary to kneel during the anthem. They have more outlets to express their opinion than ever before. They can call any reporter/blogger/podcaster and start seriously addressing social issues. A few actually do, you quoted ben Watson and Richard Sherman is another. Most are just disgruntled and want to make a scene.
I don’t even blame the players. They are just a pawn in the game. They don’t know it but they are only hurting their cause.
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At least then it accomplished the goal of making even you have to stop and think about whether police brutality is or isn’t an issue. Isn’t that was peaceful protest is supposed to garner? Attention?
Solutions are separate. MLK didn’t sign the Civil Rights act or the Voting Rights act. What he did was bring attention to injustices and people’s attention was diverted towards those issues.
“I am no longer accepting the things I cannot change. I am changing the things I cannot accept.” -Angela Davis
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Fucking preach.
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Bear in mind this is written by somebody who idolizes Jackie Robinson for what he did to integrate baseball. My only ballcap is a replica Brooklyn Dodgers cap I’ve had for years, largely because of Robinson.
You keep typing about research. I have researched this subject quite a bit.
Do you (or the NFL players) know the actual stats on the percentage of blacks killed during traffic stops vs the average? Because iirc cops are actually less likely to shoot a black person during a traffic stop than a white person. This is not an epidemic anywhere but in the media.
We would probably save more lives lowering the speed limit on highways by 1/2 a mph.
My issue with this movement is not that there isn’t still injustice, it’s (as the WSJ wrote yesterday) the “Politicization of Everything” and the fact that we don’t seem to have a sense of proportion about anything, and one YouTube incident is worth more than all the data you can throw at an issue.
I respect their right to kneel, I respect the owners’ right to fire them if they choose, and I respect fans’ right to stay away. I also think our idiot president and idiot BLM need to find more constructive things to do with their time.
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This is an absolutely fair response and the way we should be discussing this.
As I said – everybody is free to feel however they want about it. You seem to be getting hung up on my research comment though. My comments about research are directed at jack-wagons like CO when they issue sweeping declarative statements about players not understanding why they’re protesting something because he’s seen no evidence of an articulate response of which there are plenty of examples out there of articulate responses from players if he just bothered to look them up (which he obviously didn’t).
That to me is inherently questioning their sincerity which is some outright bullshit. Whether right or wrong; these guys are aware of what they’re doing, why they’re doing it, and the consequences associated with it. You can agree or disagree with them. You can certainly question the wisdom of what they’re doing. However, to just come to a conclusion about their conviction or their motivations without even bothering to even listen to an interview isn’t the best support for your position.
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Can some of you guys on the Kaepernick side please respond to Cosmic Dawg’s comment above about the statistics and evidence related to police violence towards blacks. I have tried my best to research this topic as well and found the same results. This is why the BLM stuff and this protest irritate me so much: There is no reliable statistical evidence that supports the notion that blacks are killed or abused by police at a rate that is significantly higher than any other portion of the population, including whites. This whole movement is based on a sort of quasi-religious belief in racist police brutality that is universally accepted by the left with no evidentiary basis.
If someone could provide that evidence to me, I might jump on board. I have never seen it.
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CK’s “movement” was wildly unpopular last year and only had a small fraction of support from the players.
Trump calls it out and the “movement” grew exponentially. That’s some 4D chess mastery by POTUS45.
Again, a marketing genius. How dare him be so patriotic [triggering intensifys].
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The owners have zero interest in asserting those rights because they’d lose the team and then lose games and then lose money.
I guess its more important to value money over everything else than to have actual human values and be less than your whatever your standard is of “articulate.”
BTW: The players, with very few exceptions, were admitted to a college and apparently passed a good deal of classes along the way. This is substantially more education than many Trump supporters. After all he loves the poorly educated.
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Way to paint 52 Million Americans with the “uneducated” brush while trying to convince me that the NFL is full of Rhodes scholars. Hilarious.
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I was actually trying to convince you that they are all part time nuclear scientists and brain surgeons while simultaneously convincing you remove your cranium from the interior and anterior aspect of your lower colon.
Total fail I guess.
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That was a quote from the President, by the way
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I would consider taking a closer look at your assumptions and take a respectful look at the other side rather than dismissing people for being inarticulate ignorants who blame others for their problems.
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Again, I await anyone to show me a clip of a current NFL player, who is disrespecting our flag in protest, articulate why they are doing it in a coherent, thoughtful, fact based manner.
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Took like a really long time to find. About ten seconds. I’m sure you tried before you made the assertion and that your failure is an issue not of honesty or effort but an issue of your complete incompetence.
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“I wanted to honor freedom and liberty”…by disrespecting the flag. Brilliant!
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You said no one said why he did it in a “coherent, thoughtful, fact based manner.” Apparently you meant that you needed someone so articulate that he convinced you that he was right.
On that basis I’d like to anybody to post an “articulate, thoughtful, fact based” statement from any American citizen that convinces me to vote for Trump in 2020 and the absence of such will serve as demonstrative proof that no Trump voter is “articulate, thoughtful or fact based.”
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Again, I asked for an example of someone who could articulate what the protest is about and you provide a clip of a dude saying “i want to honor freedom and liberty” by disrespecting the flag and kneeling during the anthem. Makes as much sense as having hip surgery for a heart condition.
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I understand you disagree. Its wrong to say he’s “inarticulate.”
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Derek, this asshole troll has been here before under another name. Time to ignore.
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Is it Sides?
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You are not worth arguing with and I sure wouldn’t make up another name to do it. I have seen you make up stats to support your constant arguments. I now just like to make fun of your shitty blog and your lack of social life.
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And I thought there couldn’t be two people quite that dumb. Are you twins?
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“After years of trying and failing to find an audience (or any feedback) for subjects more complex than those addressed in the 24-hour news cycle, I decided that I needed a place to discuss, learn and occasionally vent about meaningful issues.”
I am glad you found your audience here. It just isn’t me.
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Yes. “Asshole troll” because you 1. disagree with my argument and 2. can’t form a counter-argument.
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Still waiting you bunch of knuckle dragging troglodytes.
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Yes, He’s a genius alright. I suppose you believe the following statements to be true and brilliant also?
I smoke because I want to honor my health.
I beat my wife because I want to honor our wedding vows.
I root for Auburn because I graduated from UGA.
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I understand you disagree. Its wrong to say he’s “inarticulate.”
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“Wrong”? You must mean that you think I’m somehow morally wrong, because it is 100% factually correct to state that he is inarticulate, by definition. See below.
adjective. 1Unable to express one’s ideas or feelings clearly or easily
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By your standards you are the most inarticulate person I’ve ever come across. You have no good ideas and all your expressions are borne of ignorance.
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The point is not to disrespect the flag. The point is to bring attention to an issue that the protestors felt were not getting the attention/discussion/change that it deserves. I have not heard of a single person saying that they are kneeling to specifically disrespect the flag.
I would think that you could understand that the vehicle of the protest does not have to be action that the protest is to change.
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Ummm, kneeling during the national anthem IS disrespecting the flag. Again, what exactly are they protesting?
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This: http://www.charlotteobserver.com/opinion/editorials/article170734512.html
And their supporter in the White House.
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First of all, there are no Nazi’s anymore. They were defeated and disbanded in Germany in 1945. Second, that you think the POTUS, who has an orthodox jew as a son-in-law and and a converted jewish daughter, is a sympathizer of a political party that is no longer in existence, tells me just how far off the reservation you are. I cannot stop laughing.
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Why is a kneeling player a “SOB” and a torch wieding Nazi screaming “Jews will not replace us” a “very fine person?”
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“There are bo Nazis anymore?”
Ok, yeah, yooire either a trill or a moron.
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So true: http://www.americannaziparty.com/
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Exactly. There are LITERALLY dozens of Nazis all across the country. We must dedicate every waking moment to stopping them from their eminent takeover.
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Perhaps we should spend more time on the dozens of Antifa?
Put me down as one who thinks one nazi is too many Nazis.
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You really think the membership numbers are equivalent? Most large cities have antifa branches. Colleges can’t invite conservative speakers because of safety concerns over antifa thugs. When’s the last time a left wing speaker cancelled a college speech because of the threat of Nazi protests?
Now, I know that the Nazis scare you. But you just can’t stamp out every kook out there. Lots of people believe in Bigfoot. What should we do about them? Hank Johnson believes that Guam is in danger of capsizing from too many troops. What should we do about that guy?
What you need to do is recognize the size and scope of a particular threat. Bigfoot believers aren’t much of a threat. Nazis may march, but they’re marginalized. Hank Johnson is just a rubber stamp for Democrats. He doesn’t have very much individual power, although he’s much more powerful than probably all the Nazis in the country put together.
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I think that if you put the neo-Nazis, the klan, white nationalists, anti-semites and thier sympathizers together you’d have a significant plurality.
Ck Trumps approval numbers today. That’s about where they stand in terms of numbers.
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You’re just buying into the mob mentality hysteria. Anybody who doesn’t believe that the borders should be thrown open, or that the failures of government can be solved with more government must be a Nazi. It’s bullshit and you should know better.
But it is a helpful rhetorical device in creating hysteria. Most reasonable people can’t get upset about about a few dozen Nazis. But if you just insist on classifying everybody to the right of Maxine Waters as a Nazi, why you’ve discovered tens of millions of people to worry about. Great job!!!
Sorry, I’m not buying. Nazis are one of the most marginalized political groups in the country, if not the world. You can worry about them if you want, but it would more productive to worry about the Rent is Too Damn High party.
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And not sure if the only form of protest you are against is kneeling, but here is Malcom Jenkins, who is protesting by raising a fist, explaining his actions:
https://www.sbnation.com/2017/9/6/16262416/malcolm-jenkins-anquan-boldin-video-demonstrations
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Yeah, raising a fist during the national anthem, as started by the black panthers and first brought into sports by Jesse Owens at the ’68 Olympics, is just as disrespectful. Still trying to figure out what these “injustices” they speak of are, though.
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Here’s one: http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/85103764-132.html
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Don’t let the facts hit you on the ass on the way out.
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Blacks protested over the right to vote not too long after the country finally allowed one half the white population (women) to vote. Should Blacks have shut their mouths during a time when white women weren’t allowed to serve on juries in Alabama? That bar went away in 1966. So by STATS what was MLK bitching about in the early 1960’s?
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CO, your facts conveniently leave out the fact that the blacks only make up 13.3% of the US population and whites are 61.3%. You would expect more total whites killed, because there are 4.6 times as many whites in the population.
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I thought Malcom and Anquan were pretty articulate about what they were protesting about, including very specific legislation they are trying to get passed. But maybe you didn’t watch past the first :22 of the video…
But I think more likely is that you just don’t believe these injustices are reality. Maybe that is because you have never personally witnessed them or because you believe they are the reaction of some unjust action that the perpetrator/victim did first or maybe you have some personal bias against certain groups of people. I’ll even give you the benefit of the doubt and say that maybe you just think the media has blown certain injustices out of proportion. But none of those mean that what they are talking about aren’t real issues and ones that would make America a better place for us collectively.
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I think a good analogy would be myself bringing attention to the issue of illegal immigration by burning a Mexican flag at a sports event. Would that be ok with you guys? Because all I am trying to do is bring attention to the issue, not disrespect Mexicans or their flag.
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“the owners have every right to tell them whether they can protest or not.”
Of course. If you own something, you can tell it what to do.
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Yes, this is just like WWII and Nazi’s. Just like it. Great example.
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Thanks. It’s great because nobody knows how to tell people what to do better than me. So let’s hold a Rally. That’s where I do my best work.
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Yes, again, awesome example. Black athletes being paid millions for sport protesting, I don’t know what, and being called out by the POTUS for disrespecting the flag by kneeling during the national anthem, is just like WWII. Just like it.
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“Black athletes being paid millions for sport protesting, I don’t know what,”
They’re protesting the murder of black people by cops and me being a white separatist but don’t tell anybody.
I’m not because I’ve got more important things to do like speaking with the latest God-fearing, gay-hating carny who’s joining the circus to #MAGA!
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Facts are hard I guess for the mandatory group-think left.
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It sure is but my handlers are telling me I’ve got to take a lunch break now. Taking the Marine 1 chopper over to KFC for my first lunch and then back to the Club for the second. Drop by some time. You’ll like it. Catch you on the flipside!
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I’m back from the lunching. Saw Junior at the Club and decided to screw around with him by making him have some quality time with meatloaf.
When choppering out of the Club, radar picked up a bogey on our six. The Great Jersey Whale beached himself again outside the compound. So I ordered #antifa troopers over to unstrand him and have a Huey airlift him to Puerto Rico as part of the tremendous relief effort. Going into radio silence now for supper.
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+infinity
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Oh brother. The analogy here would be actors talking about politics in the film instead of speaking their minds. Nobody is trying to tell the NFL players what to do out of uniform.
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YOR TALKIN POLITIKS WHEN WE GOTTA WORRY BOUT EASON BEING READY FOR UT?!!!!!
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Please pass the oxygen…I’m feelin a bit feint, there.
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It’s important to tell us in which direction you are feinting, left or right?
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Senator, you truly have a politicly tolerant blog, and commend you for that.
If only the NFL would follow your lead. The NFL has long established no political statements from the players, until the don’t.
The NY teams wanting to honor the victims of 9/11 in the 15th anniversary with a patch and one player with custom shoes? Nope. The Cowboys wanting to honor the Dallas POs brutally gunned down in domestic terrorism with a patch on their unis? Nope. A player wanting to honor his mom that just passed away from breast cancer by wearing pink not during breast cancer awareness month? Nope.
Kneeling for the flag and anthem, which again, is against the rules and precedence of the League? You’re God damn right you can, and they’ll support you efforts.
Please Senator, don’t let the inmates ever run your asylum.
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Did you read the linked article?
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No, I don’t read fake news on an organization I’m boycotting.
Murica!
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Yeah, you only read the propaganda you’re given from Herr Trump’s ministry of talking points. What a patriot!
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Or not….http://www.snopes.com/must-nfl-players-stand/
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I have always complimented you on your brilliant writing style. I love this site because it is informational and thought provoking… and really appreciate you letting those of us that don’t agree on politics have our say… the Dewars and Derek not withstanding. : )
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You’re welcome.
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Can we at least agree that the genesis of these protests was about how terrible America is and a refusal to show support for it, the flag or anthem? CK in his own words:
“I am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses Black people and people of color.”
http://ftw.usatoday.com/2016/08/colin-kaepernick-49ers-national-anthem-sit-explains/amp
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Technically speaking, wouldn’t the genesis be the treatment of people of color he protests?
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Can “America” treat people a certain way? America can’t literally treat people in any way, shape, or form. It’s an entity. People can treat people a certain way. Yet CK and the NFL players are protesting people. They are protesting the entity and what it stands for.
Said differently, if a cop beats the hell out of me how can that be the fault of America, the flag, anthem, Declaration of Independence or anything else essentially American?
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About your “entity” point, let me refer you to Radley Balko, a dyed-in-the-wool libertarian who used to write for Reason magazine and now does so for the Washington Post.
Read some of his stuff about abuse of police power and then tell me how it’s just about people.
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I agree that police abuse needs to be seriously addressed, and I agree with Balko’s writing about the subject 99%. However, neither he, nor you nor anyone else has adequately explained a causal linkage between the police abuses in this country that have occurred almost exclusively at the municipal level and to the nation itself, the symbols that represent it and the values and principles represented.
Simply put, why should we blame America and the principles it represents to the world and us for the abhorrent actions of some city cops instead of the cops themselves and the political and government systems responsible for their actions?
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I have watched Congress, the White House and the Supreme Court steadily dismantle my constitutional rights over the past several decades in the names of the War on Drugs and the War on Terror. Maybe that’s why.
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There is zero link between the NSA, the DOJ, the federalized WoD, WoT and city cops shooting unarmed blacks which, by the way, the FBI released numbers the other day: 16.
To be clear I’m not minimizing that. Those were 16 individual lives and not a statistic. They didn’t deserve what they got, and I oppose holding innocent people to blame for crimes they didn’t commit. Which is another part of my underlying premise of opposing the NFL protesting America.
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Are you not paying attention to what Jeff Sessions has been doing?
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Is he killing African-Americans or materially giving aid and comfort to those who are? I’m confused about how Jeff Sessions is the one CK was protesting one year ago or the linkage.
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Please enlighten us as to how ANYTHING Jeff Sessions has done has ANYTHING to do with city cops shooting fewer black people than they do white people.
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Seriously, WTF does that have to do with the conversation I was having with mcnease?
You are free to pursue whatever tangent you wish to pursue here. Just don’t expect to drag me into it.
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If it’s ok to hold America as a whole responsible for the actions of some cops then is it ok to hold Islam responsible for the actions of a few terrorists?
Do you see what I’m getting at?
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I see what you’re getting at. I disagree with your underlying premise, though.
If bad cops and prosecutors were being punished for their behavior, I might concede you’re on to something. But the system routinely gives them a pass.
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Then protest “the system” responsible which is decidedly not America, the values in the Declaration of Independence, etc. If a handful of radicalized Sunnis start chopping heads off we don’t blame all of Islam. That’s my “underlying premise.” To Muslims that’s blaming all of Islam, and to Americans the NFL protests look like blaming all of America. That’s a really crappy strategy of making America better, and it will do absolutely nothing about the War on Drugs you mentioned earlier. I guess it helps as an emotional release, but it’s counterproductive to the stated goals.
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So if you don’t believe they look that way, you’re not an American?
Welcome to the Trump campaign message for next year’s mid-terms.
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“So if you don’t believe they look that way, you’re not an American?”
A) I didn’t say that B) I’m not sure how you can think I implied that C) as this particular thread started the original protest WAS against America itself D) in this thread you have yourself implicated America because of the WoT and WoD yet now you seem to be saying it’s not about America.
To be clear: 1) these protests are in fact about America 2) all citizens whether they agree or disagree with the protests are Americans 3) nobody in fact believes this protest isn’t against America because even those who claim it’s not when pressed say “yeah, America is at fault for these injustices.”
To put this in too simplistic terms I think it’s wrong to blame hundreds of millions of individuals who make up “America” for the injustices perpetrated by some other individuals (even if those individuals are elected officials), but supporters of the protests think it’s just and right to do so.
CK’s quote from above makes this very clear. Repeated for clarity:
“I am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses Black people and people of color.”
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I think there are structural flaws in the American justice system that 9/11 worsened in our security fears. You can call that blaming America or whatever you want.
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“black people” have been oppressed so much that one of them was elected president. Twice.
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I agree there are problems, serious ones, with our justice system: the plea bargaining system, no prosecutorial misconduct, asset forfeiture, abuse of RICO…. All of those problems are the fault of some Americans, but not America. America is a set of ideals we aspire to. Those can’t be blamed for what inherently flawed humans do in this world. Blaming America for wrongs committed by Americans is akin to blaming the Bible, Torah or Koran for sin.
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I think we’re having a debate over semantics at this point and those are unwinnable. You seem to agree with me that there are structural flaws in the system, which I what I think is the source of protests. I understand that you think the messenger corrodes the message.
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Wanting to make something better =/= Declaring it terrible.
Unless, that is, you run on a platform that America is terrible and needs to be made great again.
So much the cognitive dissonance.
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While the sentiment, making America better, is an honorable one, I think the method and substance of the protest itself is both wrong and counterproductive regardless of the goals.
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I would theorize that standing in front of the local mosque or synagogue and yelling at the people entering or exiting that Jesus is God will probably not convince them to change their views
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Agreed. But how bad of a leader do you have to be to push so many to normalize CK’s protest?
As I said the other day I agree with Jim: “I want to be in his corner, and I do think, ‘God bless him,’ ” Brown said. “I’m going to give you the real deal: I’m an American. I don’t desecrate my flag and my national anthem. I’m not gonna do anything against the flag and national anthem. I’m going to work within those situations. But this is my country, and I’ll work out the problems, but I’ll do it in an intelligent manner.”
But this jackass is so awful that he’s normalized something that wasn’t popular with really anybody, even those who would normally be sympathetic to CK’s viewpoint. That is just total failure as a leader.
It does have political currency because race always has had great value in this country to divide and to conquer. No politician since Wallace, while seeking national office, has tried so transparently to cash that check as Il Douche consistently has.
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To the man who runs the best football site on the web, I would simply say this; Just because football and politics ARE linked at times, it doesn’t mean they SHOULD ever be.
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A significant number of Americans have been trying to tell the rest of us that our country isn’t living up to its values. Hopefully, peaceful protest will encourage more folks to listen – unfortunately I think it simply plays into the simple us/them politics of superficial patriotism.
Still, I hope that maybe people in Flint won’t have to go much longer without clean water.
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I find it interesting and very hypocritical that the NFL will fine players for displaying pro US messages or “unauthorized” displays of remembrance for 9-11 victims or some other political or social statement but demonstrations against the US are not only tolerated but supported by the league and it’s owners. I guess free speech and the right to protest only applies when the speech is acceptable to the media and the PC crowd.
In the end, the market will decide if this “stand” the players are taking is acceptable. The NFL is selling a product, nothing more. How their product is received and purchased by the public will determine if they have made a wise decision. The time and money the public spends on the NFL is purely discretionary, the dollars and the time can easily be transferred to some other leisure/entertainment activity or product. With close to 70% of the public disapproving of their actions, the NFL may have crapped in their mess kits.
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^This
However, I think many are missing the elephant in the room when it comes to the business model. As a business, the NFL and the owners are trying to mitigate any revenue losses by siding with its workers/players over its clients/fans. High skilled workers are valuable to a company and I understand why the league and owners are doing this, but they are essentially letting the inmates run the asylum.
You better believe the first owner that comes out overtly supporting Trump’s call for not kneeling they will be labeled racist and will jeopardize future player acquisitions with the nonstop onslaught of the fakes news media social media shit storm.
The owners and the NFL are held hostage by political correctness.
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And not like Jerry Jones compromise, but actually firing/reprimanding a player.
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Broadway Joe and I each had our own private Vietnam.
https://twitter.com/gwyddbwyl/status/912822838062596097
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I come for the football and football fan experience. I skip most of the senator’s posts about ‘politics’, “the Georgia way”, the UGA Admin, etc, because it too alike the political discussions on the web, and the tone is similarly replete with snark and cynicism. I don’t seem to disagree with him, and concede that he may be doing heroic work holding people accountable- but its not what I am looking for, in substance or style. So I just skip those.
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How’s Mizzou doing since embracing BLM? I’m not a big fan of firing people for expressing political views be they football players or alt right. But I also recognize that if they are acting in such a way to damage the business that may be necessary. That is clearly what’s happening with the NFL
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This ^^^ x 1,000.
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Also, Trump thanks CK and company for giving him an issue he can win on and distracting from Obamacare, the wall, and N Korea.
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Your site, your rules. I prefer no politics with my entertainment, but as you say, I can just easily skip over, and I usually do.
Thanks for this site, Senator. Still my favorite stop on the internet.
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You do you, brother.
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If only everyone thought and acted like me…
I don’t think anyone should have opinion but Wayne Newton, I would take a bullet for him.
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Ha. When I was a child and would complain about other kids, my mom used to tell me, “Jared, if everyone was just like you the world would be a boring place.”
Thanks, Mom.
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Sports and politics have been intertwined from the start. They have intersected ever since we invented this games that we invest so much time, money, passion, and energy as fans, players, coaches, etc. It has crossed over into all aspects of the sports experience – tax policy for stadium builds, anti-trust exemptions, non-profit status, amateurism, integration/segegration, Title XI, protests, terrorist acts, paid patriotic displays, telling athletes how they should or shouldn’t celebrate or speak their mind, athletes, coaches and owners refusing to vote for somebody or visit with someone due to politics, free agency, Congressional hearings for safety issues in football, or boxing or youth sports, drug policy, gambling, etc.
The list is probably way longer than this – it is quick snapshot of how much they intersect. I just chuckle when I hear people say that sports should be free of politics. Where would they like to start removing politics from sports? Do they want to start with federal tax policy? The tax policies of states and municipalities to build stadiums to lure teams to play in their area?
The Braves move to Cobb County seemed to have political elements. The SEC Championship and the CFP will be played in Mercedes Benz Stadium which seemed to have some political elements to its construction beyond just the tax breaks. Members of Congress have weighed in on the policies of the NFL, the NBA, MLB, the NCAA.
When it comes to athletes or coaches and their views, whose voice to do think should ‘t be heard? Tommie Smith or Tom Brady? Tim Thomas or LeBron James? Tom Lehman or Steph Curry? Bob Kuechenberg, Jim Langer? Gregg Popovich, Steve Kerr or Lou Holtz and Mike Leach? Bobby Riggs or Billie Jean King? We could go on and on …
People who don’t see politics in sport today or its history are either very naive or intellectually dishonest. People who think that politics has no place in sports are unrealistic.d
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Don’t forget the ultimate mixture of politics and sports … the decision to boycott the 1980 Summer Olympics.
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“whose voice to do think should not be heard? Tommie Smith or Tom Brady?”
Tommie Smith.
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I’m 70 years old and I have lived through a lot of bullshit from politicians in my time but we are at the point now that we were when the War Between the States started. The country is divided, even more so than during the Vietnam War. It is almost evenly divided. It is divided by political parties and by geography, red sates blue states. Nobody really listens to the other person’s point of view. Each side dismisses the augments out of hand. There is no longer “common ground”. If you agree with me you are great, if you disagree with me you are evil. I may not live long enough to see it but in the words of Jesus and President Lincoln “a house divided against itself cannot stand.” We are royally screwed and our elected representatives are the chief cause of our problems. They pander to the mob. Americans, when left alone and free from government get along. It takes politicians to lite the fires and it is all in the name of political power. They could care less about the people, we are just a means to an end for them. I’ll be long gone by the time the fighting starts and this crap I will not miss.
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Don’t forget the propaganda spewed from Fox news for years has a lot to do with it and they are nothing but a political organization.
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Fox is certainly right wing. But I don’t think Fox can compete with the left wing histrionics of MSNBC.
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Like when Fox News colluded with the RNC on debates and picking the party’s candidate?
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This^^^ x 1,000
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Are you serious in that statement and letting the other news outlets slide? You got to get over it Hillary lost.
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“We are just a means to an end for them.” You are dead on 69, and that is why I did not vote in this election. That is MY protest.
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Wait, this is about a few people getting shot by police? Meanwhile your medical industry is accidentally killing 3000 Americans a day with preventable mistakes and no one gives a sh$t. Call me when we get some perspective on the obvious http://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2016/05/03/476636183/death-certificates-undercount-toll-of-medical-errors
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Tort reform will take care of that. Believe me.
The only person who receives similar protection from the legal system for acts resulting death than a police officer is a doctor.
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What’s the O/U On replies ? I really should have taken an over at 5-1 …I could use a few extra bucks.
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Who gives a damn? Just consider what the NFL is made up of.
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Tell me more…
Wealthy businessmen? World-class athletes? Pop culture icons?
oh, a pack of dogs just showed up…
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Individuals that could not get into an institution of higher learning if they could not run the forty in 4.2 seconds or weigh 260 lbs and run down Sonny Michel. Any more questions?
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Yes – how many t-shirts without stains do you own?
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I just buy the ones with patterns that have several colors allowing the food to blend in.
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I come for the politics; I stay for the comic relief!
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Now what the Hell is that supposed to mean? I am 69 and don’t understand the jargon of people like you. You must be one of the worthless millenial generation.
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It’s along the same lines of “did your parents have any children that lived?” If you don’t get that its rhetorical, well then that’s why you were on the wrong end of the joke.
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Nah, not so much a question, but rather a statement that you managed to spell a 4-letter name wrong.
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So what? You knew who the hell I was talking about.
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and there’s your overt racist showing up to comment.
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I have no problem with that statement. I am a social darwinist. If you do not know what that means, consult the internet.
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So, the long standing stereotype of jocks being dumb is now racist. Can I still call a techie a nerd, or is that racist or something phobic?
Race baiters gonna race bait.
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Oh, hey, it’s you again! Out to defend your racist brethren I see.
Did you not notice the post directly above yours where the man voluntarily admits to being a racist?
Sorry, but this is not your safe space where you and your racist brethren can pat each other on the back about how much more you love America than those damn libruls and minorities. If you make dog-whistle comments like the mouth breather above, you’re gonna get called on it.
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Why, I bet he gives the overtly racist “OK” hand gesture.
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Race wasn’t mentioned until it was assumed. Isn’t that latent racism?
Stop being a racist please.
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This whole debate is about race. it’s the literal topic of discussion. Just because ole reptile brain up there managed to conclude that outright saying the n-word would maybe hurt his argument doesn’t mean that he was smart enough to hide his true meaning from the rest of us.
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Also, good job on your taking your talking points from Crooked hillary. Dog whistle lol
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So standing up to racism is a Hillary Clinton talking point now? By the way, if you cared to educate yourself at all, you’d know that the term dog whistle existed long before Hillary ran for president.
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Here’s a great example of dumb jock using his HS education to talk about grown up talk:
http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2017/09/what_lebron_james_had_to_say_a.html
Highlights:
“I don’t think a lot of people was educated.”
“And I think that’s one of the biggest problems that we have that when it becomes vote time”
“that people are just not educated on either the individual or what’s actually going on in the state of the world right now. Not that particular state, but in the state of the world.”
“And they make choices and say things that are uneducated.”
“And I’m saying that the people of Ohio wasn’t educated?”
“Am I saying that some of the other states that voted for him was uneducated?”
It was definitely whitey that oppressed Lebrons education lol
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You really want to go down this road? Really? With President “I know words, I have the best words” sitting in the oval office? Mr. Covfefe himself?
Sometimes when people speak extemporaneously, especially in front of a large audience, their thoughts mix together or they conjugate verbs improperly or make other grammatical errors. This is true of everyone from LeBron to Trump to you or me. That doesn’t mean what they’re saying doesn’t have merit. Here’s what the same man you quoted said after his house was vandalized with racial slurs:
“”Hate, in America, especially for an African-American, is living every day. Even though it’s concealed most of the time — people will hide their faces and will say things about you and then when they see you they smile in your face — it’s alive every single day. And I think back to Emmitt Till’s mom, actually. It’s kind of one of the first things I thought of. And the reason that she had an open casket is because she wanted to show the world what her son went through as far as the hate crime, and being black in America.
“No matter how much money you have, no matter how famous you are, no matter how many people admire you, being black in America is tough. And we’ve got a long way to go for us as a society, and for us as African-Americans, until we feel equal in America. But, my family is safe and that’s what’s important.”
But you knew that. Go on. Keep trying to move the goal posts around. I’ll keep putting it through every time.
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And by overt racist, you mean someone who didn’t specifically mention race, right?
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The topic of discussion is race in America. The man literally admitted to being a racist.
Good luck defending that.
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Oh, I’m not defending it. I’m on your side. Those racists are tricky. That’s why we anti-racists, or antira, have to pick out the dog whistles and infer where the racism is coming from. Then, when someone makes a comment about NFL players not being intelligent, we can translate that using our “Racism to English” system, to show that, actually the statement was meant to be racist, and thus shouldn’t be considered. Ad hominem for the win!
Also, watch out for those “OK” hand gestures. Now, the racists don’t even have to make seemingly non-racist statements to prove they’re racist. They can just give the ole okey-dokey with the fingers, and we’re all triggered! Keep up the good fight.
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I am not inferring anything. The man literally admitted to being a racist.
And I have no idea what your hand gesture thing is about. No one has mentioned it but you. Keep building those strawmen though.
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You don’t have to convince me. The statement, “Just consider what the NFL is made up of,” is obviously a LITERALLY racist statement. Just like Trump is LITERALLY Hitler. That’s what the word LITERALLY means, anything we can infer, based on whatever we want. That’s the benefit of being antira.
And if you’re going to continue in antira, you need to brush up on your dog whistles.
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Ok dude. You’ve clearly gone off your rocker. In response to the comment “and there’s your overt racist showing up to comment”, the man replied “I have no problem with that statement.” He acknowledged being a racist.
I’m sure you wish he didn’t, because then you could go on pretending that all the other bullshit he spouted wasn’t racist because he didn’t actually use the n-word or whatever arbitrary qualifications you think it takes, but he did. And now you look like a lunatic for defending him and linking to some crazy conspiracy theory that no one here but you has mentioned.
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Exactly. First, we can infer his LITERAL racism from the statement that didn’t mention race. Second, we can again infer LITERAL racism by his statement that he doesn’t mind being called a racist.
Now, some calmer individuals may choose to give him the benefit of the doubt. He could mean it in the sense that, being called a racist doesn’t upset him, not that he is actually a racist. But we know better. We know that multiple statements avoiding explicitly mentioning race is a LITERALLY racist thing to do.
Also, please don’t turn your back on your antira brethren. We’re all out here fighting the good fight against LITERAL racism where racists try to hide their racism by making statements that don’t mention race. The least you can do is accept our support. And don’t back away from other LITERALLY racist dog whistles. Sure, everybody knows that statements that don’t mention race is explicitly racist. But not everybody knows about other things that don’t appear to be racist, but we know obviously are.
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Again, we don’t have to make any inferences. One poster says “you’re a racist” and he says “I’m fine with that statement.” You can write in all caps and post crazy conspiracy theories and pointless gifs all day long to try to twist that around, but those words came straight from his mouth.
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Dude, I’m with you. When you accuse someone of being racist, and he says he’s fine with that, he obviously doesn’t mean that you’re not going to hurt his feelings. He obviously means that he agrees that he is racist. Especially when we can combine his statements with the LITERALLY racist statements that don’t mention race. But that we know he means. Even though he didn’t use the words. But that doesn’t matter. 😉
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When accused of being a racist, he agreed. He didn’t say “you can’t hurt my feelings because I know I’m not a racist”. He said “I have no problem with that statement.” Post all the memes you want but it’s undeniable.
That is totally putting aside his stance that somehow football players are too stupid to have an opinion on politics, which is equally inane. Or that he insults milennials for no reason whatsoever.
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Dude, you can stop arguing with me because I share your exact position. When you acuse somebody of being a racist and he says, “Fine,” the only way to interpret that is that he’s a racist. In fact, the only way to interpret most statements is that he’s racist. Even though he doesn’t explicitly say it. We don’t need him to say it because we can crack the code of everything=racist.
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As desperately as you want it to be something else, he admitted to being a racist in the simplest terms possible. That’s about as explicit as it gets. You can put words in my mouth and his all you want but you can’t run away from that and it’s clearly bothering you. Because now we have an outright statement from the man acknowledging his racist views, and so saying “he didn’t explicitly mention race though!” holds no weight. Even if he hadn’t admitted it that argument would still be preposterous, but he did, and there’s nothing your ineffectual meme posting and straw men can do to change that.
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Exactly. He admitted being a racist by not saying anything about race or racism. That’s how sneaky these racists are. It’s implicitly explicit, whatever those words mean. Thank God we antira are on the job exposing racists whenever they don’t expose themselves by not mentioning race.
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Except he did say something about racism. He admitted to being one. So now you have to take that into consideration when he starts spouting off his opinions. When an admitted racist says the NFL is made up of “individuals” too stupid to have an opinion on politics, and the NFL is made of of 70% minorities, well it doesn’t take a genius to see what he’s referring to. Besides that, there is a long history in this country of using euphemisms to disguise racism, and that’s exactly what is going on here, as I and others have pointed out. It’s really quite clear, no matter how many times you say otherwise.
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Right. He said it by not saying it. We can’t quote him, but we don’t need to. We know that “individuals” means blacks. Or at least 70% of blacks. And because we antira aren’t geniuses, we know what he means. We can tell when a euphemism is literally an explicitly racist statement. Because it always is.
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We can quote him. I have been quoting him. It’s very straightforward. He said some racist dog whistle bullshit, got called out on it, then decided to double down and admit he was a racist.
“We can tell when a euphemism is literally an explicitly racist statement. Because it always is.” – What does this sentence even mean?
And I never said blacks. I said minorities. See your own racism creeping in there? You managed to hold out all these stupid posts but you finally F’ed up. Congrats.
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Right. We’ve been quoting him saying things that don’t mention race. But we know that it’s dog whistle bullshit. And come on, you don’t know when euphemisms are literally explicitly racist? Here’s a hint. All things are literally and explicitly whatever we interpret them as. That’s what my SJW dictionary defines literal and explicit as. Whatever I need them to be. Language that doesn’t mention race is literally and explicitly racist (according to my SJW dictionary that handily reverses the definitions of language whenever it suits me).
Good point on the blacks. 70% of the NFL is minority. I simply inferred that you meant blacks. This protesting movement certainly hasn’t been primarily put forward by black players. Obviously we’re ignoring the huge numbers of Jews, transgenders, and Sikhs playing in the NFL. It really was stupid of me to generalize ALL of the minorities in the NFL to be mostly blacks. I’ll go put my antira hair shirt on now. Thanks for holding me to account, brother. Keep up the fight against racism which is quite literally and explicitly EVERYWHERE!!! Even from within our antira ranks.
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Boy it really is driving you nuts that you can’t twist your way out of this one isn’t it? The man admitted to being a racist. I didn’t say it, you didn’t say it, he said it himself. You can make up words and present fake arguments that no one ever said until you’re blue in the face, but that doesn’t change the facts. It’s clear you struggle with the concept of facts but I’m here to help. For as long as it takes.
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It’s ironic that the most intolerant people are the ones who have attacked the POTUS. Is free speech okay for him, too?
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I always love inflating criticism into censorship. I’m glad you’ve taken the message of my post so well.
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I understand that you disagree. You certainly have the right to disagree. But let’s not equate disagreement on the other side with “hate”, “racism”, bigotry, and the like. Labelling people that disagree with you is a form of censorship. Marginalizing those that disagree with you as extremists, haters, and the like is an attempt to shut down free speech. Ongoing dissension and factionalism is the result. So, yes, you and the POTUS both have the right to an opinion. But if you catch yourself attacking people personally, calling names, etc., then stop and examine your motives. And that applies to you on the left, as well as me on the right.
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No. It’s not. Censoring people is preventing them from expressing their views.
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We just have to disagree. Words like “hater”, “phobic”, and the like are used many times to invalidate and marginalize the opposing point of view. Labels inhibit and invalidate and intimidate; they don’t encourage open dialogue and reasonable discussion. So, IMO, calling a person a hater just because they disagree with me is my attempt at marginalizing and censoring that person and their opinion. Again, you and I just disagree.
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There’s nothing to disagree with, you’re just wrong here. Unless someone or something (a government entity) is physically suppressing your ability to express yourself, it’s not censorship. What you’re doing is conflating censorship with freedom from consequences which is quite a common problem these days across both aisles of the political spectrum.
If I say something that you disagree with and you call me an asshole / jerk / racist / ‘phobic / whatever, I haven’t been censored. On the contrary – we’ve both freely expressed ourselves, but my assholish / jerkish / racist / ‘phobic / whatever views clearly had consequences. The First Amendment doesn’t protect you from being called out by another citizen and simply being called out by another citizen isn’t a form of censorship. It’s that citizen exercising his / her freedom of expression.
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Again, “you’re just wrong” is an interesting way to encourage dialogue. You are talking semantics. Verbally assaulting a person with nasty personal attacks, IMO, is a technique used to stifle debate and nullify a point of view you disagree with. I think stifling reasonable debate by confusing disagreement with “hate”, for example, is a very effective form of verbal censure. If you disagree with my word “censure”, that’s fine. But my point that labels and name-calling stifle free speech and debate stands.
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It is sort of up to the listener to decide on how to respond isn’t it? I mean, do you think anyone’s insult could shut me up? Its a choice.
I’m not going to be dissuaded because some jerk says that my parents deaths mean at least they can no longer be disappointed in me. What am I gonna do? Cry? Hardly. Fuck that guy.
Here’s a primer: https://markmanson.net/not-giving-a-fuck
Learn it
Live it
Love it
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“You’re just wrong here.”. This is why I wish we could stay away from politics here. There is one position here. If you don’t agree with it then you get a chorus of “Oh my God! Now I’m triggered you fucking nazi!”
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Freedom is messy and that’s why it took several millennia for people to attain it. There’s always a good reason for freedom to be restricted. Its too loud. Its annoying. I disagree. It upsets me. It is immoral. It is vulgar.
A free exchange in a community of ideas is essential to a free people though and we should never question its necessity just because its found to be unpleasant.
Ideas everyone agrees with need no protection. Its the ideas that are under attack that need your vigilant support.
As for the asshole-in-chief he has the “right” to say what he wants. It does not follow that what he says is “right.” I’m just glad I live in a country where I’m not going to be fed to a bunch of wild dogs for saying that. At least not today.
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Captain Obvious needs to change his name to Captain Oblivious
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Facts are hard Debby. Don’t let them hit you on the ass on the way out as you preach about “injustice” and “racism”.
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I absolutely adore liberals like you. I give you a graph based on actual FBI crime statistics and you give me 4 youtube videos. But “muh feels”. HAHAHAHA.
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You say there is no basis for complaint. Can you watch those videos and say there’s no basis to complain?
You can say that white people in Chris Rock’s position get pulled over too and then post that video.
I myself went through a license check not too long ago. No seatbelt, no insurance card (forgot to put the new one in my wallet) and my tag had expired. (I paid for it but it never showed up. I was pretty sure I’d be ok until the next year, because white guy, pick up truck.). I was waived through.
There is a basis for complaining. You’re too stubborn to admit it and rather accuse people of color of being irrational. That is SO not racist.
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Hey Derek, I’m black.
Game. Set. Match.
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I’ve missed you Uncle Ruckus: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BjumUKsToJQ
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Welp, there you have it folks. Derek is a fucking racist.
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Very interesting… How’s that exactly?
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Here you go lying again. So you went through a license checkpoint with expired tags, no insurance card, and as a final F U to the police no seatbelt and they just waived you through? All because you were white. Did you tell them you had a BS job at your daddy’s law firm too?
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Dad was a stone cutter. Neither of my parents made it past HS, but thanks for asking. For people who say that they aren’t prejudiced, you sure have a lot of judgments about people, that are fucking wrong.
I can’t say why I was waved through despite all that. Its not like I interrogated the officer. I am white. I drive a p/u. All that I said was true. A white officer waved me through despite the fact I had no seat belt on, no current insurance card and my tag was expired.
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Your parents must be Trump supporters. He loves the poorly educated.
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Deceased. But again, thanks for asking. You want to state anymore prejudgments?
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At least you can’t disappoint them anymore.
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Classy,
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“A little tolerance goes a long way, tone-wise.” Both ways my friend, both ways
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Derek…..get you ASS back to work!!!!!!!!
Senator, you owe me two hours minimum wage for the time my employee has wasted here today.
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Fortunately, (the wife notwithstanding) I’m my own boss. Its something I highly recommend to anyone.
Me: Hey Boss, can I fuck around little while longer on Blutarsky?
Boss: Sure why not?
We’re gonna decide what we want to eat for lunch now. Its good to be the boss. I would agree that I should be golfing or fishing instead of this though.
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If you get near L. Seminole, give a shout. I know a few places where the bream hit your fishing fly like piranhas. Sometimes a 5 lb bass will take it similar to a bream and you have to be a mite more careful when using a leader that tapers to 3-4 lbs.
And I’m retired. Woops! The Amnesian wants to go for a boat ride. Adios.
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Thanks for the invite and enjoy!
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I am not going to argue whether entertainers should keep politics out of their business one way or the other, but I will argue that it is not in their best interest to veer outside of their stage. Everyone is for free speech, but unpopular free speech also comes with consequences.
This has become an epic PR crisis for the NFL. The owners stand to lose millions of dollars and fan bases that may take years to recover if at all. The smart players have already realized the damage they have done and are beginning to backtrack as the weekend’s protest has backfired. If I was an educated college player with NFL hopes I would be pissed right now at seeing my future earnings potential get obliterated over a publicity stunt gone wrong.
The fact is this isn’t about Trump, or politicians, he merely acknowledged the opinion of the vast majority of NFL viewers. A few players started this over a false narrative and now it has come back to bite them. Whatever Goodell was thinking by encouraging this offensive behavior towards the NFL fanbase one can only imagine. After last year’s protests the NFL was projected to lose around $200 million in revenues this year. It looks like that could reach the billion dollar mark at this point as ratings plunge and attendance continues to drop. Heck, even Direct TV is refunding season packages now.
At this point the best thing that can happen for the NFL is for its players to shut up (no matter what their politics are) and entertain us and leave the politics to politicians.
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I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume it was an oversight you posted a virtually identical comment under a different handle. Everybody screws up. Once.
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no doubt, looks like I didn’t fill in the name and it autofilled from my email address. Thanks for the catch.
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I’ll take “Political Wankery” for 200 comments, Alex.
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I read through this entire thread and it didn’t provide one bit of additional insight on our prospects for beating UT on Saturday. And I thought this was a football blog!
(all tongue in check Senator)
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I don’t agree with the Senator here but I’ll still come here for the blog! 🙂
I just feel its disrespectful to kneel. If you aren’t proud to be an American, then move in with Madonna. These cry baby millionaire football players kneeling have nothing better to do I guess. They don’t even know “why” they are kneeling in the 1st place.
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Jesus sure was crude to go into the temple and cause a big commotion turning over those tables. People were there to worship, not to watch him protest. What a nonsensical position he was taking – exercise his faith by being so disrespectful and disruptive to the temple and everything that it represented. Did he realize all the sacrifices that made the temple possible? Sad!
Moses sure is an inarticulate hothead. That guy had JUST received the commandments, freshly inscribed by the hand of his LORD… What the hell was he thinking, smashing them up as the sight of Israel’s disobedience?
Couldn’t he have found a more productive method to make his disappointment clear? Sad!
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Am I the only one that finds it ironic that people are protesting for fair treatment by protesting the flag/anthem of a country built on Enlightenment principles of equality, freedom, and reason?
American and Western values are the #1 reason that minorities of all kinds come and flourish under our flag every day.
Jerry Jones nailed it IMO: protest social injustice, but at the end of the day I’m standing for a symbol those values that celebrate your right to do so.
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They’re not protesting the flag or the anthem.
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‘”I understand why people are offended by people protesting the National Anthem,” Eagles wide receiver Torrey Smith told ESPN.’
http://www.cnn.com/2017/09/27/us/nfl-anthem-protest-race-trump-trnd/index.html
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“”It baffles me that our protest is still being misconstrued as disrespectful to the country, flag and military personnel,” 49ers safety Eric Reid wrote in an op-ed for the New York Times this week. Reid was one of the first to adopt Kaepernick’s protest, kneeling beside his then-teammate during the last pre-season game of 2016. He was also privy to the perspective of Boyer, the veteran who counseled Kaepernick.
“We chose to kneel because it’s a respectful gesture,” Reid wrote. “I remember thinking our posture was like a flag flown at half-mast to mark a tragedy.”
From the exact same article you quoted. They are not literally protesting the flag and the anthem, no matter how many times you say they are. They are using their national platform to protest racial injustice in this country, as has been said hundreds upon hundreds of times. If you’re not getting the message, that’s on you, not them.
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“I am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses black people and people of color.” – Colin Kaepernick
You can play these mental gymnastics all you want and try to spin that as some bizarro patriotism if you want, but it’s intentionally disrespectful to the country and its values.
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That sentence is not even two lines long and you still can’t see that what he’s protesting is the oppression of minorities in this country? I’m not the one doing mental gymnastics.
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I, for one, really look forward to the political posts because the Senator always makes sure to post a bunch of football stuff to compensate whenever he posts something of this nature. Y’all have at it, my brothers and sisters.
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With me, I truly just don’t like politics in my sports. Everything is politicized now and it would be nice for us all to just be able to enjoy sports and be (mostly) united in our love of theDawgs. I understand your point that politics and sports mixing isn’t new. That’s definitely true. But that doesn’t mean I have to like it. And for my part, it doesn’t matter if it is politics that I’m aligned with not. I’m a conservative but I don’t want conservative talking points in my sports. That’s just me. Your mileage may vary. And obviously I like what you do here because I read everyday. Go Dawgs!
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Laughing my ass off at anyone who believes Trump actually cares about this issue. Healthcare repeal was in the tank and Luther Strange was gonna lose. Time to change the narrative. The con man is actually an easy read.
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I thought he was also trying to bury the story that Mueller now has access to his taxes. There’s a pattern.
Whenever he says something intended to take the oxygen out of the room 24/48 hours later there will be a story that would have made headlines that is now buried.
And we know how this happens. The reporter calls the WH for comment or verification and then Trump goes about burying the story in a shit storm.
Fortunately that only works in the 24 hour news cycle and not so much in a grand jury proceeding.
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Huh?
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I vote Libertarian , every chance I get
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I am not sure which side of this cliff I should jump off of, realistically speaking You who lives in glass houses probably should not play with rocks. Perhaps answers began years ago when prayer was not allowed in school or even now on the field of dreams. Neither do we acknowledge the 10 Commandments and to say the Pledge to the Flag as we now in our 60’s to 70’s did as we did everyday in elementary to high school.
Perhaps we might remember that Jesus said “You among you without sin cast the first stone” !
I think that many of your mom’s and dad’s would certainly bust that ass and even if they chose not to if your grandfather her or grandmother were still alive they’d make you get a hickory switch and cut blisters through your wore out blue jeans. Oh that’s right we have time out. Well Look back to all above and see how well “Time Out is Working for Our Nation Now” Two Points that should Be Added #1) respect and love thy neighbor #2) Discipline of one’s own integrity and his family
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Yep, back in those days we had the patriotism and the Christian values to deny black children entrance into white schools. It had to be because of those 10 Commandments and that prayer that they could be so just in their actions toward their fellow citizens. Also they had the good sense to ensure that women would be reseated as second class citizens, no doubt because Jesus.
The idea that state sponsored religion of any type makes men better people is patently and provably false.
What I would agree with is that an individual’s respect for a God of his own choosing can instill in him the wisdom to treat his fellow man justly. Religious institutions on the other hand are self perpetuating tax free businesses that almost without expection mirror the politics of the people sitting in their pews whatever those politics may be. Hence there were no Southern Christian churches that challenged the institution of slavery. There were no German religious institutions that stood up to the Nazis. There were no religious institutions that stood up against the Indian Removal Act. I could go on.
However, Godly people like Gandhi, MLK, and Mandela used their beliefs to reverse perverse injustices in nations run almost exclusively by self described practicing Christians for whom knowledge the that God does not want you coveting your neighbor’s ass or neighbor’s wife separately or in combination had little effect on societal outcomes.
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“I do not agree with what you have to say but I’ll defend to the death your right to say it”. Evelyn Beatrice Hall
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Why the fuck did I click on this thread?…..slowly backing out
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really. I can feel myself getting dumber with every frenzied post I read. I find these threads loathsome, yet I can’t seem to look away. I’ll have to try harder next time.
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As long as the employer is okay with employees taking their time and image and attaching it to a position or protest I am in support of it. Free speech and all. But I will also express my free speech by not giving them my money if I so chose. No use for me to badger the protesters. I’ll express myself with my $$$$ Say what you like, this whole mess clears up if someone starts to lose money. And the opposite is true, if it makes money it will continue. I do wonder what would happen if someone’s free speech included a Confederate flag or maybe taking a knee to pray.
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Why does everyone have to be so sensitive now days, stand, sit, or go fly a kite, I don’t give a dang. I have my personal feelings on it but in the long run I don’t let idiots on either side bother me. I do what I feel is right and that is all I have control over.
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“President should not be telling the Washington Redskins to change their name-our country has far bigger problems! FOCUS on them,not nonsense,” Trump tweeted on October 8, 2013.
Well that and no golf.
At least there’s consistency inasmuch as the hypocrisy is a constant.
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Obviously sports is fair game for political grandstanding. But does anyone, other than people trying to sell something, actually want that?
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“Kaepernicking”—the process of adding fuel to the fire of hating police.
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